No power to the heaters: rough love story with my Octopus board

In previous episodes: 1. I bought a full kit V-core 3.1. (400) and successfully got to the PID tests as per online comissioning guide. 2. Both PID tests failed with "not heating fast enough" errors both on hotend and heat bed. 3. Using hair dryer and independent power sources, I confirmed beyond doubt that both thermistors and heaters work properly. 4. Using multimeter and changing pin assignment, I confirmed that the whole 24V section (PA1-3 & PB10-11) is dead to the world. 5. Under warranty, RatRig sent me a replacement board, which, after installation, showed exactly the same behaviour. Video links showing how I test the board: https://lib.tepewu.pl/f/ec27da3ff734446983d8/ https://lib.tepewu.pl/f/3b7ab4549a244485aaf4/ https://lib.tepewu.pl/f/99da07f115464af2abc8/ https://lib.tepewu.pl/f/9e49487af9b948d687ca/ I can offer a realtime video chat using my phone, so I can do some live testing under guidance, if somebody can spare a bit of time. Now, I am a bit desperate, as this printer is the core of a humanitarian project I am responsible for, and there is an awkward situation regarding people who pooled their money to have it started. For a quick workaround, could I use additional fan pins to control the SSR for the heatbed and add another one for the hotend? Then I would be more than happy to keep testing the spare board at a slower pace...
Czytelnia
PID_error_1.mp4
Share link for PID_error_1.mp4.
Czytelnia
PID_error_2.mp4
Share link for PID_error_2.mp4.
Czytelnia
VID_20231024_150808.mp4
Share link for VID_20231024_150808.mp4.
Czytelnia
VID_20231024_152007.mp4
Share link for VID_20231024_152007.mp4.
No description
72 Replies
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
the wiring for the 24v is clear, did you check that the polarity hasn't accidentally been switched?
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
Several times, also with multimeter. I also noted incongruence in +/- order and followed
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
hard to see from the angle you have in that photo, are the leads from your hotend plugged into heater port 0 or 1 (HE0 or HE1)?
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
Yes. I even followed polarity for a good measure.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
heaters don't have polarity
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
Videos are uploading. I know. 🙂
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
What voltage does your country use (240v?), is your PSU set to the correct switch?
RRBender
RRBender•12mo ago
You may want to take the printer config out of klippy.log, this way, you see exactly what is enabled/active, with all those includes and overrides it's hard to tell sometimes and easy to overlook something.
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
Video links added to the OP 230 V. Yes. Steppers and the rest of electronics work happily. I will revert config to standard settings, as it was when I encountered the error and made test videos
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
you need to start at the beginning. Show a video testing each set of wiring input to the board with your multimeter
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
Test graph and pinter.cfg are attached.
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
On it.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
FYI this is not a configuration issue something is wrong with your physical setup. Either the wiring, a connection, the board, etc
RRBender
RRBender•12mo ago
Hard to tell without having seen the complete configuration, only printer.cfg doesn't show the other stuff in the includes.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
they are standard ratos - nothing to see here
RRBender
RRBender•12mo ago
You believe them to be standard. But whatever. good luck to Kanenas.
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
I can extract those includes and attach them if needed.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
ok, a video of the fuses being check
RRBender
RRBender•12mo ago
just post klippy.log from the last run, that has everthing in it (klipper combines all the includes internally and puts them into the log)
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
no, you need to pull the fuses out to test them
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
ok.
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
There is one new thing that happened after I installed new board: RasPi consistently reports undervoltage. Wiring is by the book:
No description
RRBender
RRBender•12mo ago
I've compared the config with my config, heater pins config is exactly like on mine, seems right to me.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
can you take a photo of the big chip in the center of the octopus? I am wondering if they switched the chip again and thus the pin names changed
RRBender
RRBender•12mo ago
this is what Kanenas has configured: MCU=stm32f446xx
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
No description
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
No description
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
without changing your printer.cfg, can you insert your multimeter into each set of HE ports and run the PID tune again? Basically to check that PA2 isn't trying to heat up a different HE port. I don't think this will work, but I am running out of ideas
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
on it Nothing. I will try to borrow another power supply and test it. This undervoltage makes me nervous. Bad luck is I am broken for the time being (waiting for a substantial backpay, but it is crawling through bureaucracy). But I will manage somehow.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
just to rule out a broken hotend, try connecting it directly to the 24v PSU and look to see if the thermistor registers a change
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
Did it previously. First tested thermistors with the hairdryer, then both heaters with independent power sources. Everything is working and Mainsail shows readings properly.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
and you flashed the board using the ratos configurator - correct?
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
Yes. Directly. OK, before I get a power supply, what do you think about using fan pins to control the relay? It could do for a while. I already learned that extension pins are not a good idea. 🙂 But fans?
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
possibly - I have never done something like that How do you have the Bed output hooked up to the SSR?
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
The bed heater is 230V AC and the relay is hooked to the board.
No description
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
So, tomorrow I will test the solution and if it works, I will buy a DC/DC relay for the hotend.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
I can't tell from the photo where those wires go. Are both bed wires hooked to the SSR?
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
Exactly as pictured here.
No description
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
And this was also checked with independent 12V DC power
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
yeah, I am talking about the other side of the SSR
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
The AC wires go: - live through SSR - neutral straight to the PSU And when I activated SSR, everything worked fine.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
neutral to the PSU or to the wall? so the bed heats up fine?
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
The white wire comes from the bed and meets neutral wire going to the wall, and at the same time it is connected to PSU to keep one ground.
No description
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
Yes, once the relay is on.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
gotcha, not the best for wiring but a tangent for now yeah I am at a loss at how the bed out is working but all the heater ports aren't
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
Allright, I will test the fan pin solution tomorrow (too tired for hacking today) and we'll see. I am really grateful for your (and @rrbender 's) time and effort. Once I have this machine up and running, I will try to get to the bottom of it.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•12mo ago
yeah, seems strange to have two DOA boards that ONLY affect the heater ports. But everything else appears correct @miklschmidt maybe you have some insight - seems bizarre that only the heater ports are not working on 2 octopus boards
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
With the second one, RasPi undervoltages occured. I am logging out - evening chores. I will report back tomorrow.
miklschmidt
miklschmidt•12mo ago
@kanenas6812 please try disconnecting everything from the octopus except usb, power, heaters and thermistor. There must be a soft short somewhere. What voltage does the hotend heater output read when enabled?
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
Meanwhile, the workaround is on:
No description
No description
No description
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
Ok, I will. I will doublecheck output and report back. My suspicion is on PSU
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•12mo ago
I was wrong. Through elimination, it was the part cooling fan. It has a tricky wiring (depicted) and, by recommendation from RR, one wire is left unconnected. I do not know if this is a faulty fan, or wrong instructions, but after disconnecting it, everything works. Thank you for pointing me in this direction!
No description
No description
No description
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•11mo ago
So, another step ahead: I realised that printer.cfg says: FANS If your board has 4 pin fan headers and you want to use them, you can enable them here. NOTE: If none are uncommented, the default 2pin fan headers will be used. ############################################################################################################# Part cooling #[include RatOS/4pin-fans/part-cooling-fan-25khz.cfg] #[include RatOS/4pin-fans/part-cooling-fan-100hz.cfg] As I have NIDEC W40S12BS2E5-57T04HF9, anybody knows which option is suitable?
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•11mo ago
Not applicable, the octopus doesn't have 4 pin fan headers
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•11mo ago
RaRig says differently:
No description
No description
No description
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•11mo ago
no, it doesn't. Those includes are for boards that have 4 pin fan headers. The octopus doesn't have these, so just ignore them
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•11mo ago
Well, so now I am waiting for RatRig answer - meanwhile I am going to map "default 2 pin headers", just in case. 🙂 OK, config for Octopus says that the default header for part cooling fan PA8 - where the blue wire is connected. The rest goes to "FAN7" which I could not identify in config files. Makes no sense to me. Toolhead cooling is PE5 and it checks Controller cooling is supposedly PD12 but I do not know how to trigger it, so I cannot test. I will run PID tests again to warm the controller up an we'll see.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•11mo ago
@kanenas6812 what error are you getting? This is just standard Rat-OS setup. You are pulling the power from the always on fan header and the pwm from the IO pin for the blue wire
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•11mo ago
When the fan is connected like this, it causes the initial problem. @miklschmidt asked me to disconnect everything byt heater-related and then everything worked. When I started connecting pins one by one, it stopped working when I connected the part cooling fan.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•11mo ago
Can you show us a picture or pictures of the entire wiring of you fan? Sounds like there is short somewhere
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•11mo ago
Wires go straight from headers to the toolhead, where they are connected with fan wires. White wire is left unconnected as per RR instructions.
No description
No description
No description
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•11mo ago
those wagos connect all the wires together. I believe that is what is causing your short issue
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•11mo ago
Such a stupid mistake - I asked for a connector for three wires, and did not check what they sold me. <shameface>
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•11mo ago
I personally used jst-sm, but microfit would work too. You want a crimped connection as anything soldered will break from the movement
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•11mo ago
Yeah, I have something in my drawer. But first, testing. Another insanity. Once I connected power, the fan started in the opposite direction and the control is also reversed. But this is obviously the matter of config.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•11mo ago
add
[fan]
pin: !fan_part_cooling_pin
[fan]
pin: !fan_part_cooling_pin
to your user overrides section
grumpy-cyan
grumpy-cyan•11mo ago
Yes, done. And I am about to flip the fan, so the air flows the right way. Ugh.. One stupid mistake, out of stress, and it cost me two months. And all of you, gentlemen gave me your time, knowledge and attention - my gratitude is only second to my embarrassment. Whenever you happen to be in Poland, you may count on me in case of need. Thank you.
blacksmithforlife
blacksmithforlife•11mo ago
I did a couple trips to Poland during my semester abroad - such a great place. I still have the nice warm leather hat I bought there in the Krakow market
Want results from more Discord servers?
Add your server