I also suggest folks to stop thinking about DOs in terms of "created" and "destroyed". It's a mindsh

I also suggest folks to stop thinking about DOs in terms of "created" and "destroyed". It's a mindshift, but it will simplify lots of things for your architecture designs. A term commonly used is "virtual objects".

You just access it and use it. If it doesn't exist, it will be created, and if it was already accessed before you will be routed to the same instance. Forget about the classical management of server instances.

The only case you need to care about lifecycle management, is if you want to stop paying for an object's storage, and again, you don't "destroy it", you just access it as usual and

deleteAll()

deleteAll()

its storage. That's it. Storage gone, the object lives forever though, you can still access it and write new data later if needed, or never access it again.

Silvan•4/26/25, 8:45 AM

i think of DOs as a Singleton Class that is in the cloud

plgingras88•4/26/25, 8:28 PM

That's right, the paradigm is different with DO. But as per their docs, Cloudflare stated that "Dynamic relocation of existing Durable Objects is planned for the future.". This will definitely be a gamechanger for many devs having moving targets around the world - https://developers.cloudflare.com/durable-objects/reference/data-location/

Cloudflare Docs

Data location · Cloudflare Durable Objects docs

Jurisdictions are used to create Durable Objects that only run and store data within a region to comply with local regulations such as the GDPR or FedRAMP.

SH•4/26/25, 10:27 PM

Does anyone know of any security concerns regarding DurableObject ids? Let's say that I posted the ids of all my durable objects here, could anyone do anything with them? My impression is that the answer is 'no' - DurableObjects cannot be connected to unless you can bind the class to the worker, and you can't bind classes across accounts. Therefore, if I published my DurableObject ids to the whole world, nobody could make any trouble for me.

The one thing that gives me pause is the assertion that DurableObject ids are globally unique, across all accounts. So, if Cloudflare isn't protecting things correctly, if I have your DurableObject's ID I could otherwise connect to it.

I have no desire to publish these ids, I am just trying to find out how sensitive they are - mostly to determine what logs they might appear in.

SSH Does anyone know of any security concerns regarding DurableObject ids? Let's say...

Hello, I’m Allie!•4/26/25, 11:32 PM

To connect to a DO given its ID, you need to be on the account it was generated from. I don’t remember if IDs are globally unique across all accounts or not, but regardless, others would need access to your account to hit that one DO, at which point you are already in bad shape if they are malicious

HHello, I’m Allie!To connect to a DO given its ID, you need to be on the account it was generated ...

lambrospetrouOP•4/27/25, 12:15 AM

You cannot connect to DO IDs of a different namespace. The ID you connect to has to be from the namespace used to access it.

veeque•4/27/25, 3:50 PM

I have a DO with the following method:

but when called like this:

it "loses" the fact that it's a , since the

console.log

console.log

s show:

So somewhere in transit that information seems to get lost (notice how the

code

code

isn't printed anymore. even checks with fail)... how can i deal with this?

JustWayne•4/27/25, 3:52 PM

Question: If I abort a DO, do I have to re-create any instances/stubs that are still being used by my worker?

My guess is yes since the docs say:

If an exception is thrown by a Durable Object stub all in-flight calls and future calls will fail with exceptions. To continue invoking methods on a remote Durable Object a Worker must recreate the stub.

https://developers.cloudflare.com/durable-objects/api/stub/#description

Vveeque I have a DO with the following method: ```ts async reserve(): Promise<Result> {...

lambrospetrouOP•4/27/25, 4:11 PM

That's documented in https://developers.cloudflare.com/workers/runtime-apis/rpc/error-handling/

When returning custom Errors only name and message are transferred back and not the full error type. So, won't work.

My suggestion is to use the message as the source of information if you will be doing error matching. And add the error type as a prefix in the message so that you can check that if you want.

Llambrospetrou You cannot connect to DO IDs of a different namespace. The ID you connect to has...

SH•4/28/25, 2:03 AM

Thank you, so much. I very much appreciate the prompt confirmation - very helpful!

HHello, I’m Allie!To connect to a DO given its ID, you need to be on the account it was generated ...

SH•4/28/25, 2:06 AM

Thank you for the confirmation! So happy to have had two affirmations from Cloudflare employees, so quickly!

For reference, my understanding that IDs are globally unique come from https://developers.cloudflare.com/durable-objects/platform/known-issues/#:~:text=Global%20uniqueness%20guarantees%20there%20is,)%2C%20and%20upon%20accessing%20storage.

The way I read that (and maybe I'm reading that wrong) is that IDs are unique to DurableObjects accross all accounts, and therefore not partitioned by account - at least in there ID reference. That's what gave me the pause of a 1% possibility in my mind that I felt I need to confirm before treating the ID is non-sensitive info.

But, you both cleared it up for me - thank you, again, so much!

Cloudflare Docs

Known issues · Cloudflare Durable Objects docs

Durable Objects is generally available. However, there are some known issues.

planet•4/28/25, 4:31 AM

When I run , I visibly observe the go down e.g. 77824 -> 4096, and all data is deleted. A few moments later if I keep refreshing, all the data comes back as if it was never deleted. I can run it again and I notice the same size change. Then a few minutes later I refresh again and this time it does not come back at all.

I'm not using the KV storage in any form, just SQLite backed DOs. is what I'm experiencing normal or should I be doing extra validation on ?

Pplanet When I run `deleteAll`, I visibly observe the `databaseSize` go down e.g. 77824 ...

lambrospetrouOP•4/28/25, 7:22 AM

If you and the caller function returns successfully it should be all you need.
You say you observe data deleted in terms of size too, so it does go through.
We don't restore your data automatically unless you restore to a bookmark yourself.

planet•4/28/25, 7:59 AM

(video is long just to show in real time what I'm experiencing. feel free to skip to the end to see the data come back)

DDeleted User I'm able to reproduce this every time. I'm assuming I am doing something wrong? ...

lambrospetrouOP•4/28/25, 8:29 AM

I think that error is relevant to the delete you try to do and it probably means the delete doesn't fully go through, or that error causes the deletion to be reverted. I will forward it to the team to investigate more.
Your code is correct in terms of the delete code.

planet•4/28/25, 8:29 AM

i see. it was a one time error, thought I'd include it regardless just incase. Thank you

Fernando Barroso•4/29/25, 1:35 PM

Hey there! Has anyone here used workers analytics engine for back-office/analytics on a DO-per-user setup? I am thinking of either using WAE or a tree structure of DOs where I have a “parent” DO keep track of all its children via an initialization function and later on asynchronously via alarms.

Has anyone done anything like this?

JJan Wilmake Hey, DORM author here. No, from my perspective it's not meant to replace Turso ...

gruntlord6•4/29/25, 3:22 PM

the deploy button doesn't work, not sure if thats your template or a limit of durable objects
✘ [ERROR] Could not find zone for . Make sure the domain is set up to be proxied by Cloudflare.

FFernando Barroso Hey there! Has anyone here used workers analytics engine for back-office/analyti...

lambrospetrouOP•4/29/25, 3:52 PM

Yes, that's common.
You can avoid the alarms by only having active DOs "heartbeat" to your "parent" DO, instead of waking them up with alarms all the time. Unless you do need that, of course.

Vy•4/29/25, 3:52 PM

Following https://blog.cloudflare.com/d1-read-replication-beta/, CF team is starting to think about how replication looks for Durable Objects. If you have a use case for DO read replication, reply to this message (feel free to share your use case too) and I'll reach out separately.

Ggruntlord6 the deploy button doesn't work, not sure if thats your template or a limit of du...

lambrospetrouOP•4/29/25, 3:54 PM

You need to update that to your domain.

Llambrospetrou You need to update that to your domain.

gruntlord6•4/29/25, 3:54 PM

is it possible to update the template to use the worker domain or is that just something that always has to be done manually on the users end

Ggruntlord6 is it possible to update the template to use the worker domain or is that just s...

lambrospetrouOP•4/29/25, 3:55 PM

You need to remove this line: https://github.com/janwilmake/dorm/blob/a818944b8a55690bed5d209011dae616a832b1e2/wrangler.jsonc#L7
Assuming that's what you try to deploy.

Llambrospetrou You need to remove this line: https://github.com/janwilmake/dorm/blob/a818944b8a...

gruntlord6•4/29/25, 3:56 PM

that would make the deploy button work without user intervention?

Edit: Thank you, as always very helpful

eckoln•4/29/25, 4:08 PM

Hey there. What is the cost of messages in internal websocket connection between DOs? Is it included in incoming messages?
In my usecase, i want to use DO to DO internal websocket connection. I will send one client message to between (3+) DOs. In this case, will 1 message be counted as 3+ messages?

Eeckoln Hey there. What is the cost of messages in internal websocket connection between...

lambrospetrouOP•4/29/25, 4:52 PM

For compute requests billing-only, a 20:1 ratio is applied to incoming WebSocket messages to factor in smaller messages for real-time communication. For example, 100 WebSocket incoming messages would be charged as 5 requests for billing purposes.

From https://developers.cloudflare.com/durable-objects/platform/pricing/

veeque•4/29/25, 7:55 PM

Is there a way to "export" data from all DOs? Say I were to build my app using DOs, but then for some reason I need to move to some other infra, can I export the SQL data stored in every DO for migration purposes?

Vveeque Is there a way to "export" data from all DOs? Say I were to build my app using D...

boop•4/29/25, 8:44 PM

Not natively, you'll have to implement that logic yourself

Llambrospetrou Yes, that's common. You can avoid the alarms by only having active DOs "heartbea...

Fernando Barroso•4/29/25, 11:29 PM

by heartbeat you mean whenever a significant action is done it calls back to the parent?

Vveeque Is there a way to "export" data from all DOs? Say I were to build my app using D...

gruntlord6•4/29/25, 11:32 PM

I think they shared a script here that does what the d1 export does

jcheese•4/30/25, 12:05 AM

I am getting

for a specific DO ID, other IDs in the same namespace works fine. can anyone help?

Jjcheese I am getting ``` GET http://dummy-example.cloudflare.com/cdn-cgi/partyserver/se...

Larry•4/30/25, 12:40 AM

My first suspicion would be that there is something in the data for the instance that is causing it. I suggest wrapping your fetch, onMessage, onRequest, etc methods with a try/catch and logging the details.

LLarry My first suspicion would be that there is something in the data for the instance...

jcheese•4/30/25, 12:42 AM

yeah, ive done that but i keep getting

Kiwi•4/30/25, 5:57 AM

How do I go about debugging ?

Grzkpl•4/30/25, 6:03 AM

Fix Needed for Bug in CF Email Notification System general-help[Cloudflare]: [ACTION REQUIRED] Daily usage limit exceeded for Cloudflare Durable Objects

VVy Following https://blog.cloudflare.com/d1-read-replication-beta/, CF team is star...

Danny Navarro•4/30/25, 7:36 AM

More than a direct use case, I was hopeful read replication would enable dynamic relocation of DOs. If a worker accesses the DO from another data center it gets read replicated right there. After the DO gets evicted, next time it's accessed, if there was already a read replica in the new data center, that replica gets promoted to write leader.

Also, it'd be nice to have locally replicated DO sqlite files for debugging. Maybe with something like

DDanny Navarro More than a direct use case, I was hopeful read replication would enable dynamic...

lambrospetrouOP•4/30/25, 9:23 AM

Also, it'd be nice to have locally replicated DO sqlite files for debugging. Maybe with something like wrangler do --namespace <ns> read <id> <db.sqlite>

You mean, doing an export/dump/copy right once? You don't expect things to be replicated locally in real time when changes happen remotely.

After the DO gets evicted, next time it's accessed, if there was already a read replica in the new data center, that replica gets promoted to write leader.

This is something that we are thinking about but not as part of read replication. Moving the primary should take into account more than just a single request, so it wouldn't work like that, but yeah the team at some points wants to be able to move primary DOs.

Llambrospetrou > Also, it'd be nice to have locally replicated DO sqlite files for debugging. M...

Danny Navarro•4/30/25, 9:34 AM

You mean, doing an export/dump/copy right once? You don't expect things to be replicated locally in real time when changes happen remotely.

Right, I don't really care about real-time. I was thinking about explicitly doing a one way sync with a command, maybe is a better word. A command to export just once would be great, the one way sync would be just an optimization.

VVy Following https://blog.cloudflare.com/d1-read-replication-beta/, CF team is star...

John Spurlock•4/30/25, 1:45 PM

long time wish: export/backup/archive DO with read-only access to another DO's storage but without competing with the main DOs incoming request queue - a minimal replication delay would be fine

veeque•4/30/25, 4:15 PM

why is the 10gb limit a hard limit? it's not like the data has to travel to other locations, given that a DO only ever exists in the datacenter it was created.

Vveeque why is the 10gb limit a hard limit? it's not like the data has to travel to othe...

lambrospetrouOP•4/30/25, 4:26 PM

Few reasons, cold starts would be very slow and it would be hard to get the fast SQLite performance from local queries if you had to load pages from remote most of the time (even with caching). Also, the fact that the DOs do not move (yet), is just because it's not implemented, yet.

Llambrospetrou Few reasons, cold starts would be very slow and it would be hard to get the fast...

jed•4/30/25, 6:45 PM

is this still in the works? it’s been almost five years since the announcement that cloudflare “can transparently migrate objects between locations.”

Jjed is this still in the works? it’s been almost five years since the announcement ...

lambrospetrouOP•4/30/25, 7:05 PM

There is transparent migration already, but only when the original location is down, and not due to request traffic.

JJan Wilmake thanks. will remoive it, idk how to fix it either

gruntlord6•4/30/25, 8:27 PM

I think they said this will fix it durable-objects

jcheese•5/1/25, 1:04 AM

will DOs re-initialize whenever theres a new deployment that changes code? meaning, will the get called everytime when theres a new deployment and the DO gets accessed?

Jjcheese will DOs re-initialize whenever theres a new deployment that changes code? meani...

1984 Ford Laser•5/1/25, 1:05 AM

No but any open/hibernated Websockets will be terminated

11984 Ford Laser No but any open/hibernated Websockets will be terminated

jcheese•5/1/25, 1:08 AM

i see, but how can a js class have it's underlying code updated to even receive the new migrations in the file w/o actually re-initializing the class?

1984 Ford Laser•5/1/25, 1:09 AM

It will get called the next time the DO is accessed, but not immediately upon deployment. Sorry if thats what you meant

11984 Ford Laser It will get called the next time the DO is accessed, but not immediately upon de...

jcheese•5/1/25, 1:15 AM

i see. then do you know why for migration libs like this: https://github.com/lambrospetrou/durable-utils?tab=readme-ov-file#sqlite-schema-migrations

require in all sql queries, instead of a one off in the constructor?

GitHub

GitHub - lambrospetrou/durable-utils: Utilities for Cloudflare Dura...

Utilities for Cloudflare Durable Objects and Workers - lambrospetrou/durable-utils