Neurons aren’t a thing anymore - it’s token based now, but nothing in the UI reflects that

J

JamesOP•1/6/25, 12:02 AM

It’s usage based though - you just pay for how many you use

JJames Neurons aren’t a thing anymore - it’s token based now, but nothing in the UI ref...

B

bat ✞•1/6/25, 12:02 AM

But what about the "5k/10k daily neurons used"?

JJames Workers AI pricing is all kinds of confusing right now. Docs talk about tokens w...

J

JamesOP•1/6/25, 12:02 AM

That’s outdated, hence the confusion

J

JamesOP•1/6/25, 12:02 AM

Upgrade to workers paid and then it’s usage based

JJames That’s outdated, hence the confusion

B

bat ✞•1/6/25, 12:02 AM

Yeah I'm pretty confused

JJames Upgrade to workers paid and then it’s usage based

B

bat ✞•1/6/25, 12:02 AM

Ah, by the way by every token is it per character or per word?

B

bat ✞•1/6/25, 12:02 AM

Like what do you guys define a token as

J

JamesOP•1/6/25, 12:03 AM

I couldn’t tell you, frankly. Docs are confusing and there’s no usage reports in the dash for tokens to clarify

JJames I couldn’t tell you, frankly. Docs are confusing and there’s no usage reports in...

B

bat ✞•1/6/25, 12:03 AM

0.000015$ per token, does that mean per word?

J

JamesOP•1/6/25, 12:03 AM

Hopefully we’ll get some clarification soon - this was meant to happen November 1st but didn’t

J

JamesOP•1/6/25, 12:03 AM

I don’t know

B

bat ✞•1/6/25, 12:03 AM

Oh alright

B

bat ✞•1/6/25, 12:03 AM

I just need to know before we start paying

J

JamesOP•1/6/25, 12:04 AM

Sorry I can’t be of more help. We’re (the community) all just as confused as you

B

bat ✞•1/6/25, 12:04 AM

As we don't wanna go around spending too much, though 1 token per word seems more reasonable

JJames Sorry I can’t be of more help. We’re (the community) all just as confused as you

B

bat ✞•1/6/25, 12:04 AM

Yeah it's alright thank you alot

Bbat ✞0.000015$ per token, does that mean per word?

C

Chaika•1/6/25, 12:31 AM

This is a more generic AI/LLM question, tokens are their sort of base building blocks, not always matching up with a single word: https://www.johno.com/tokens-vs-words

CChaika This is a more generic AI/LLM question, tokens are their sort of base building b...

B

bat ✞•1/6/25, 12:33 AM

Thank you!
But for example, if I used only latin and symbols, how much would a token be?

C

Chaika•1/6/25, 12:33 AM

Depends on the model you use/it's tokenizer

C

Chaika•1/6/25, 12:35 AM

For example, OpenAI's tokenizers are like this: https://platform.openai.com/tokenizer, cool visulization to play around with

C

Chaika•1/6/25, 12:36 AM

one for a model that is on Worker's AI, Lllama 3's https://lunary.ai/llama3-tokenizer
Mistral and Gemma's linked on that one too

CChaika one for a model that is on Worker's AI, Lllama 3's https://lunary.ai/llama3-toke...

B

bat ✞•1/6/25, 12:55 AM

What about mixtral's?

Bbat ✞What about mixtral's?

I

Isaac McFadyen•1/6/25, 1:29 AM

Mixtral uses the Mistral tokenizer.

I

Isaac McFadyen•1/6/25, 1:30 AM

So it'll be the same as the Mistral button on that page.

IIsaac McFadyen Mixtral uses the Mistral tokenizer.

B

bat ✞•1/6/25, 1:31 AM

Oh alright thanks

K

kyle•1/7/25, 6:26 PM

I noticed that llama 3.1-8B is out of beta as of the past month or so, but I don't see any reference to this in the Workers AI changelog. imo a billing-impacting change like this needs to be mentioned in the changelog

Cloudflare Docs

Changelog · Cloudflare Workers AI docs

Review recent changes to Cloudflare Workers AI.

B

blindChicken•1/7/25, 9:03 PM

I don't see any reranking models in the models offered by CF. Is there any plan to add one or more in the near future? BAAI embedding models are offered, it would be great to also offer their reranking model: https://huggingface.co/BAAI/bge-reranker-base.

CChaika hmm guessing it's still cooking? It throws ` "message": "5006: must be st...

Z

zabatonni•1/8/25, 6:27 PM

not working for me, what it should be? I tried uint8, base64 but nothing seems to work

L

LordQ•1/9/25, 10:21 AM

Hi, do you know how to get more than only 5 labels and scores as the result?

D

Destiny•1/10/25, 9:31 AM

does setting width and height to 2048 result in a 500 error?

D

Destiny•1/10/25, 9:31 AM

i am on a free plan

D

Destiny•1/10/25, 9:37 AM

also when i set the width to 1600 and height to 900. i seem to get this error

AiError: AiError: Invalid or incomplete input for the model: model returned: Invalid input

AiError: AiError: Invalid or incomplete input for the model: model returned: Invalid input

AiError: AiError: Invalid or incomplete input for the model: model returned: Invalid input

AiError: AiError: Invalid or incomplete input for the model: model returned: Invalid input

E

ella•1/10/25, 1:33 PM

i have cf enterprise. is there anyway to upload my own mode lto workers ai?

E

ella•1/10/25, 1:44 PM

bruh

DDestiny also when i set the width to 1600 and height to 900. i seem to get this error `...

R

Raylight•1/10/25, 3:20 PM

Make sure width and height are multiples of 8, e.g. try 1600 x 896 instead.

KKorcan `InferenceUpstreamError: undefined: undefined` ``` at Ai._parseError (cloudflare...

C

Chris Jayden•1/11/25, 12:39 PM

Did you ever figure this error out? I'm also getting it locally when trying to work with AI...

My dev command is:

wrangler dev --port 8787  --experimental-vectorize-bind-to-prod --inspector-port 9229

wrangler dev --port 8787  --experimental-vectorize-bind-to-prod --inspector-port 9229

wrangler dev --port 8787  --experimental-vectorize-bind-to-prod --inspector-port 9229

wrangler dev --port 8787  --experimental-vectorize-bind-to-prod --inspector-port 9229

U

user•1/12/25, 2:13 AM

Can you not pass previous messages to AI when using LoRA? Every time I try, the message content is empty.

U

user•1/12/25, 2:13 AM

It doesnt return any errors, just nothing.

U

user•1/12/25, 2:15 AM

also, i keep constantly getting error

3028

3028 when using LoRA

AAleksandar Hello. Was this issue with `InferenceUpstreamError: undefined: undefined` fixed?...

F

flashblaze•1/15/25, 2:07 AM

Were you able to fix this? I have a similar code using Hono

app.post(
    '/get-alt',
    zValidator('form', getAltSchema),
    async (c) => {
        const { image } = c.req.valid('form')

        try {
            let imageData: ArrayBuffer;
            if (image instanceof File) {
                imageData = await image.arrayBuffer();
            } else {
                const response = await fetch(image.toString());
                if (!response.ok) {
                    return c.json({ error: 'Failed to fetch image from URL' }, 400);
                }
                imageData = await response.arrayBuffer();
            }

            const imageBytes = new Uint8Array(imageData);

            try {
                const response = await c.env.AI.run('@cf/meta/llama-3.2-11b-vision-instruct', {
                    prompt: 'Create a concise alt text for this image. Use simple language and keep it under 160 characters.',
                    image: imageBytes
                });

                return c.json(response);
            } catch (error) {
                console.error('AI processing error:', error);
                return c.json({ error: 'Failed to process image with AI model' }, 500);
            }
        } catch (error) {
            console.error('Image processing error:', error);
            return c.json({ error: 'Failed to process image data' }, 500);
        }
    }
)

app.post(
    '/get-alt',
    zValidator('form', getAltSchema),
    async (c) => {
        const { image } = c.req.valid('form')

        try {
            let imageData: ArrayBuffer;
            if (image instanceof File) {
                imageData = await image.arrayBuffer();
            } else {
                const response = await fetch(image.toString());
                if (!response.ok) {
                    return c.json({ error: 'Failed to fetch image from URL' }, 400);
                }
                imageData = await response.arrayBuffer();
            }

            const imageBytes = new Uint8Array(imageData);

            try {
                const response = await c.env.AI.run('@cf/meta/llama-3.2-11b-vision-instruct', {
                    prompt: 'Create a concise alt text for this image. Use simple language and keep it under 160 characters.',
                    image: imageBytes
                });

                return c.json(response);
            } catch (error) {
                console.error('AI processing error:', error);
                return c.json({ error: 'Failed to process image with AI model' }, 500);
            }
        } catch (error) {
            console.error('Image processing error:', error);
            return c.json({ error: 'Failed to process image data' }, 500);
        }
    }
)

app.post(
    '/get-alt',
    zValidator('form', getAltSchema),
    async (c) => {
        const { image } = c.req.valid('form')

        try {
            let imageData: ArrayBuffer;
            if (image instanceof File) {
                imageData = await image.arrayBuffer();
            } else {
                const response = await fetch(image.toString());
                if (!response.ok) {
                    return c.json({ error: 'Failed to fetch image from URL' }, 400);
                }
                imageData = await response.arrayBuffer();
            }

            const imageBytes = new Uint8Array(imageData);

            try {
                const response = await c.env.AI.run('@cf/meta/llama-3.2-11b-vision-instruct', {
                    prompt: 'Create a concise alt text for this image. Use simple language and keep it under 160 characters.',
                    image: imageBytes
                });

                return c.json(response);
            } catch (error) {
                console.error('AI processing error:', error);
                return c.json({ error: 'Failed to process image with AI model' }, 500);
            }
        } catch (error) {
            console.error('Image processing error:', error);
            return c.json({ error: 'Failed to process image data' }, 500);
        }
    }
)

app.post(
    '/get-alt',
    zValidator('form', getAltSchema),
    async (c) => {
        const { image } = c.req.valid('form')

        try {
            let imageData: ArrayBuffer;
            if (image instanceof File) {
                imageData = await image.arrayBuffer();
            } else {
                const response = await fetch(image.toString());
                if (!response.ok) {
                    return c.json({ error: 'Failed to fetch image from URL' }, 400);
                }
                imageData = await response.arrayBuffer();
            }

            const imageBytes = new Uint8Array(imageData);

            try {
                const response = await c.env.AI.run('@cf/meta/llama-3.2-11b-vision-instruct', {
                    prompt: 'Create a concise alt text for this image. Use simple language and keep it under 160 characters.',
                    image: imageBytes
                });

                return c.json(response);
            } catch (error) {
                console.error('AI processing error:', error);
                return c.json({ error: 'Failed to process image with AI model' }, 500);
            }
        } catch (error) {
            console.error('Image processing error:', error);
            return c.json({ error: 'Failed to process image data' }, 500);
        }
    }
)

And each time I'm sending an image, getting this error. No matter what size I send.

AI processing error: InferenceUpstreamError: undefined: undefined

      at Ai._parseError (cloudflare-internal:ai-api:81:20)
      at async Ai.run (cloudflare-internal:ai-api:61:23)
      at null.<

AI processing error: InferenceUpstreamError: undefined: undefined

      at Ai._parseError (cloudflare-internal:ai-api:81:20)
      at async Ai.run (cloudflare-internal:ai-api:61:23)
      at null.<

AI processing error: InferenceUpstreamError: undefined: undefined

      at Ai._parseError (cloudflare-internal:ai-api:81:20)
      at async Ai.run (cloudflare-internal:ai-api:61:23)
      at null.<

AI processing error: InferenceUpstreamError: undefined: undefined

      at Ai._parseError (cloudflare-internal:ai-api:81:20)
      at async Ai.run (cloudflare-internal:ai-api:61:23)
      at null.<

K

kai•1/15/25, 7:32 AM

Is it possible to run our own model using workers ai or we can only use the available open source models?

Fflashblaze Were you able to fix this? I have a similar code using Hono ```ts app.post( ...

L

lord5et•1/15/25, 8:34 AM

Any ETA on fixing this? I have same issue with following hono code:

app.get("/transcribe", async (c: Context) => {
  const res = await fetch(
    "https://github.com/Azure-Samples/cognitive-services-speech-sdk/raw/master/samples/cpp/windows/console/samples/enrollment_audio_katie.wav"
  );
  const blob = await res.arrayBuffer();

  const input = {
    audio: Buffer.from(blob).toString("base64"),
  };
  console.log("AI");
  console.log(c.env);
  console.log(c.env.AI);
  const response = await c.env.AI.run(
    "@cf/openai/whisper",
    input
  );

  return Response.json({ input: { audio: [] }, response });
});

app.get("/transcribe", async (c: Context) => {
  const res = await fetch(
    "https://github.com/Azure-Samples/cognitive-services-speech-sdk/raw/master/samples/cpp/windows/console/samples/enrollment_audio_katie.wav"
  );
  const blob = await res.arrayBuffer();

  const input = {
    audio: Buffer.from(blob).toString("base64"),
  };
  console.log("AI");
  console.log(c.env);
  console.log(c.env.AI);
  const response = await c.env.AI.run(
    "@cf/openai/whisper",
    input
  );

  return Response.json({ input: { audio: [] }, response });
});

app.get("/transcribe", async (c: Context) => {
  const res = await fetch(
    "https://github.com/Azure-Samples/cognitive-services-speech-sdk/raw/master/samples/cpp/windows/console/samples/enrollment_audio_katie.wav"
  );
  const blob = await res.arrayBuffer();

  const input = {
    audio: Buffer.from(blob).toString("base64"),
  };
  console.log("AI");
  console.log(c.env);
  console.log(c.env.AI);
  const response = await c.env.AI.run(
    "@cf/openai/whisper",
    input
  );

  return Response.json({ input: { audio: [] }, response });
});

app.get("/transcribe", async (c: Context) => {
  const res = await fetch(
    "https://github.com/Azure-Samples/cognitive-services-speech-sdk/raw/master/samples/cpp/windows/console/samples/enrollment_audio_katie.wav"
  );
  const blob = await res.arrayBuffer();

  const input = {
    audio: Buffer.from(blob).toString("base64"),
  };
  console.log("AI");
  console.log(c.env);
  console.log(c.env.AI);
  const response = await c.env.AI.run(
    "@cf/openai/whisper",
    input
  );

  return Response.json({ input: { audio: [] }, response });
});

it worked fine yesterday morning

L

lord5et•1/15/25, 8:58 AM

What is the file size limit when it comes to @cf/openai/whisper model?

Fflashblaze Were you able to fix this? I have a similar code using Hono ```ts app.post( ...

R

Raylight•1/16/25, 9:01 AM

Try changing

image: imageBytes

image: imageBytes

image: imageBytes

image: imageBytes to

image: [...imageBytes]

image: [...imageBytes]

image: [...imageBytes]

image: [...imageBytes].

Llord5et What is the file size limit when it comes to @cf/openai/whisper model?

R

Raylight•1/16/25, 9:41 AM

The file size limit was roughly 2.6MB last time I tested, but it depends on the content and whether or not it's supplied as a JS array. See workers-ai. If it's possible to use base64, the limit should be higher. I haven't tested it, though.

Fflashblaze Were you able to fix this? I have a similar code using Hono ```ts app.post( ...

D

dmaretskyi•1/16/25, 10:55 AM

seeing the same error with stable-diffusion model

Fflashblaze Were you able to fix this? I have a similar code using Hono ```ts app.post( ...

S

Siddanth Reddy•1/16/25, 2:05 PM

facing same error with @cf/meta/llama-3.1-8b-instruct-awq

✘ [ERROR] Error in /chat handler: InferenceUpstreamError: undefined: undefined

at Ai._parseError (cloudflare-internal:ai-api:76:20)
at async Ai.run (cloudflare-internal:ai-api:57:23)
at async _ContextManager.analyzeQuery

S

Siddanth Reddy•1/16/25, 2:29 PM

and same issue with : @cf/mistral/mistral-7b-instruct-v0.1

InferenceUpstreamError: undefined: undefined

InferenceUpstreamError: undefined: undefined

InferenceUpstreamError: undefined: undefined

InferenceUpstreamError: undefined: undefined

S

Siddanth Reddy•1/16/25, 2:30 PM

To force the models to respond, I sent the same message multiple times (around four attempts), which temporarily resolved the issue. However, the problem appears again after a few prompts

F

flashblaze•1/16/25, 10:38 PM

I'm surprised CF has still not addressed this issue. No reply on the community post as well
https://community.cloudflare.com/t/x-error-inferenceupstreamerror-undefined-undefined/758340/2

Neurons aren’t a thing anymore - it’s token based now, but nothing in the UI reflects that

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