I'm just saying there's many ways that the usability of a "engine" I write might not matter at all,

T

TechPizza•10/29/22, 7:08 PM

i wanted to say that it would be a big undertaking to make a game engine, especially a mobile one

T

TechPizza•10/29/22, 7:09 PM

and not to shit on your abilities, but a junior would not have a fun time

J

JolleyslamOP•10/29/22, 7:09 PM

;D

JJolleyslam I'm just saying there's many ways that the usability of a "engine" I write might...

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:09 PM

Use an engine designed by a team of experts, who knows what a game engine needs and how to implement those systems efficiently

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:10 PM

If they are going to use your engine to make any other meaningful games

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:10 PM

it has to be usable by the way

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:11 PM

not to mention you need to document and explain everything, so that they can understand what is going on

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:14 PM

now, it is great for job security, if they feel forced to use it though

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:14 PM

they will have to keep you around to make their stuff work

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:14 PM

to fix this, implement that

T

TechPizza•10/29/22, 7:15 PM

don't forget about the seven eleven million bugs on mobile platforms when it comes to rendering

L

Lyris the Kitori•10/29/22, 7:15 PM

:^)

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:15 PM

ahh yep

TTechPizza don't forget about the seven eleven million bugs on mobile platforms when it com...

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:15 PM

or compute shaders gabe

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:16 PM

I hope I gave you PTSD

T

TechPizza•10/29/22, 7:16 PM

compute shaders are a joke on adreno gpus at least

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:16 PM

for loops intensifies

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:16 PM

GPU VIDEO MEMORY CORRUPTION GROWS

RRedhacker2 Use an engine designed by a team of experts, who knows what a game engine needs ...

J

JolleyslamOP•10/29/22, 7:17 PM

Yeah, that does make the most sense then, doesn't it?

I think using Silk for something like that would be fun, but maybe that should just be a hobbyist project. There's also definitely a "I don't know what I don't know" aspect here which is preventing me from really grasping the scope of such a project.
I'm not quite closing the book on Silk for this, maybe there's still some cool things to be done with it.

I saw your PM's and Stride3D looks really promising, I'll definitely be checking that out too

Thanks y'all for answering my questions and having the discussion, I really appreciate it

L

Lyris the Kitori•10/29/22, 7:17 PM

np

L

Lyris the Kitori•10/29/22, 7:17 PM

good luck on the project

JJolleyslam Yeah, that does make the most sense then, doesn't it? 😅 I think using Silk fo...

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:18 PM

welcome, but yeah I would suggest godot or stride. Silk is fine for hobbiests or if you are in a positition to build an engine, but most of the time sadly, especially with work people aren't. Its a large time-sink and costs quite a bit

JJolleyslam Yeah, that does make the most sense then, doesn't it? 😅 I think using Silk fo...

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:20 PM

I would not completely give up on silk, I would just have a backup plan laid elsewhere

R

Redhacker2•10/29/22, 7:20 PM

do silk as a secondary

J

JolleyslamOP•10/29/22, 7:21 PM

Sounds good!

F

frutiemax•10/30/22, 12:10 AM

I think that using Silk.Net you learn stuff that you wouldn't learn with an existing game engine

F

frutiemax•10/30/22, 12:11 AM

For my case I like learning the low-level bits of code and how to structure the engine from scratch... I don't have money goals though so this is working for me.

B

Bloppy•10/30/22, 2:43 AM

Hi, this is my first time in this community and I have a question.
I was following the tutorials by myself, and I just saw that the texture part requires imagesharp.
Now I am wondering if there is any alternatives for this part.

B

Bloppy•10/30/22, 2:44 AM

If you are asking for a reason, I would say I am more familiar with mit license than apache

L

Lyris the Kitori•10/30/22, 2:48 AM

you are allowed to use imagesharp freely under the conditions of

   - You are consuming the Work in for use in software licensed under an Open Source or Source Available license.
   - You are consuming the Work as a Transitive Package Dependency.
   - You are consuming the Work as a Direct Package Dependency in the capacity of a For-profit company/individual with
     less than 1M USD annual gross revenue.
   - You are consuming the Work as a Direct Package Dependency in the capacity of a Non-profit organization
     or Registered Charity.

   - You are consuming the Work in for use in software licensed under an Open Source or Source Available license.
   - You are consuming the Work as a Transitive Package Dependency.
   - You are consuming the Work as a Direct Package Dependency in the capacity of a For-profit company/individual with
     less than 1M USD annual gross revenue.
   - You are consuming the Work as a Direct Package Dependency in the capacity of a Non-profit organization
     or Registered Charity.

   - You are consuming the Work in for use in software licensed under an Open Source or Source Available license.
   - You are consuming the Work as a Transitive Package Dependency.
   - You are consuming the Work as a Direct Package Dependency in the capacity of a For-profit company/individual with
     less than 1M USD annual gross revenue.
   - You are consuming the Work as a Direct Package Dependency in the capacity of a Non-profit organization
     or Registered Charity.

   - You are consuming the Work in for use in software licensed under an Open Source or Source Available license.
   - You are consuming the Work as a Transitive Package Dependency.
   - You are consuming the Work as a Direct Package Dependency in the capacity of a For-profit company/individual with
     less than 1M USD annual gross revenue.
   - You are consuming the Work as a Direct Package Dependency in the capacity of a Non-profit organization
     or Registered Charity.

L

Lyris the Kitori•10/30/22, 2:48 AM

but yes, if you dont fall under any of those, then you can use any image decoding library

L

Lyris the Kitori•10/30/22, 2:49 AM

our examples use imagesharp because its the easiest to use and generally the standard for custom built engines in C#

I

Invar•10/30/22, 11:55 AM

Hey everyone new to openGL and silk. The examples have been a great help but I am hoping for a specific example in some form or another.

Passing a struct as an SSBO to a compute shader and retrieving the updated value.
A simple example that merely modifies two variables in the struct array would be helpful.

I have tried to follow the openGL tutorials but they are in C++ and I feel I am fighting multiple battles at a time since I am not familiar with it.

Thanks.

I

Invar•10/30/22, 3:17 PM

Here is my effort. Any help will be awesome!
The following task is to change 9000 values in an array from 8.0 to 25.0

shader.comp

#version 430 core

layout(std430, binding = 0) writeonly buffer SSBO {
    float data[];
};

layout(local_size_x = 128) in;

void main() {
    uint ident = gl_GlobalInvocationID.x;
    data[ident] = 25.0f;
}

#version 430 core

layout(std430, binding = 0) writeonly buffer SSBO {
    float data[];
};

layout(local_size_x = 128) in;

void main() {
    uint ident = gl_GlobalInvocationID.x;
    data[ident] = 25.0f;
}

#version 430 core

layout(std430, binding = 0) writeonly buffer SSBO {
    float data[];
};

layout(local_size_x = 128) in;

void main() {
    uint ident = gl_GlobalInvocationID.x;
    data[ident] = 25.0f;
}

#version 430 core

layout(std430, binding = 0) writeonly buffer SSBO {
    float data[];
};

layout(local_size_x = 128) in;

void main() {
    uint ident = gl_GlobalInvocationID.x;
    data[ident] = 25.0f;
}

Run Code Snippet

            int NUM_INVOCATIONS = 9000;
            int WORKGROUP_SIZE = 128;
            float[] vertices = new float[NUM_INVOCATIONS];
            for (int i = 0; i < NUM_INVOCATIONS; i++)
            {
                vertices[i] = 8.0f;
            }

            uint ssboIndex = Gl.GenBuffer();
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.BufferData<float>(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, vertices, BufferUsageARB.DynamicDraw);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.DispatchCompute((uint)NUM_INVOCATIONS, 1, 1);
            Gl.MemoryBarrier(MemoryBarrierMask.ShaderStorageBarrierBit);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);

            float* returnValues = (float*)Gl.MapBuffer(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, BufferAccessARB.ReadOnly);

            for (int i = 0; i < NUM_INVOCATIONS; i++)
            {
                 Console.WriteLine(returnValues[i]);
            }

            int NUM_INVOCATIONS = 9000;
            int WORKGROUP_SIZE = 128;
            float[] vertices = new float[NUM_INVOCATIONS];
            for (int i = 0; i < NUM_INVOCATIONS; i++)
            {
                vertices[i] = 8.0f;
            }

            uint ssboIndex = Gl.GenBuffer();
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.BufferData<float>(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, vertices, BufferUsageARB.DynamicDraw);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.DispatchCompute((uint)NUM_INVOCATIONS, 1, 1);
            Gl.MemoryBarrier(MemoryBarrierMask.ShaderStorageBarrierBit);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);

            float* returnValues = (float*)Gl.MapBuffer(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, BufferAccessARB.ReadOnly);

            for (int i = 0; i < NUM_INVOCATIONS; i++)
            {
                 Console.WriteLine(returnValues[i]);
            }

            int NUM_INVOCATIONS = 9000;
            int WORKGROUP_SIZE = 128;
            float[] vertices = new float[NUM_INVOCATIONS];
            for (int i = 0; i < NUM_INVOCATIONS; i++)
            {
                vertices[i] = 8.0f;
            }

            uint ssboIndex = Gl.GenBuffer();
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.BufferData<float>(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, vertices, BufferUsageARB.DynamicDraw);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.DispatchCompute((uint)NUM_INVOCATIONS, 1, 1);
            Gl.MemoryBarrier(MemoryBarrierMask.ShaderStorageBarrierBit);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);

            float* returnValues = (float*)Gl.MapBuffer(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, BufferAccessARB.ReadOnly);

            for (int i = 0; i < NUM_INVOCATIONS; i++)
            {
                 Console.WriteLine(returnValues[i]);
            }

            int NUM_INVOCATIONS = 9000;
            int WORKGROUP_SIZE = 128;
            float[] vertices = new float[NUM_INVOCATIONS];
            for (int i = 0; i < NUM_INVOCATIONS; i++)
            {
                vertices[i] = 8.0f;
            }

            uint ssboIndex = Gl.GenBuffer();
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.BufferData<float>(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, vertices, BufferUsageARB.DynamicDraw);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.DispatchCompute((uint)NUM_INVOCATIONS, 1, 1);
            Gl.MemoryBarrier(MemoryBarrierMask.ShaderStorageBarrierBit);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);

            float* returnValues = (float*)Gl.MapBuffer(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, BufferAccessARB.ReadOnly);

            for (int i = 0; i < NUM_INVOCATIONS; i++)
            {
                 Console.WriteLine(returnValues[i]);
            }

I

Invar•10/30/22, 3:25 PM

The Writeline returns 8.0.
This indicates to me that I am feeding the ssbo to the shader and retrieving it correctly but its not being operated on.
Am I correct in the assumption?

M

MrTwix•10/30/22, 3:37 PM

Hi, I'm new to Silk.NET and was wondering what the third parameters of the KeyDown action was. From what little I can find of it online its supposedly some id, but of what? It doesn't correspond to the enum key values. Is it the utf-16 id or something entirely different.

IInvar The Writeline returns 8.0. This indicates to me that I am feeding the ssbo to th...

T

TechPizza•10/30/22, 3:40 PM

you could try checking in renderdoc

T

TechPizza•10/30/22, 3:42 PM

i feel like you didn't setup the shader uniforms correctly

T

TechPizza•10/30/22, 3:42 PM

because you are creating the buffer in that snippet

I

Invar•10/30/22, 4:08 PM

Solved it.

I

Invar•10/30/22, 4:08 PM

I actually forgot to use the shader. lol
Some of the classes are from the abstractions example.
CShader is a conversion of the Shader abstraction from the opengl tutorial asbtractions example that allows to just pass one object buffer rather
than 2 (i.e. vertex and fragment for standard use vs. 1 for compute shader.

I have never tried render doc and atm I am content in my current workflow but will down the line.

            comnputeShaderTest = new CShader(Gl, "shader.comp");
            comnputeShaderTest.Use();
            uint ssboIndex = Gl.GenBuffer();
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.BufferData<float>(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, vertices, BufferUsageARB.DynamicDraw);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.DispatchCompute((uint)NUM_INVOCATIONS, 1, 1);
            Gl.MemoryBarrier(MemoryBarrierMask.ShaderStorageBarrierBit);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);

            float* returnValues = (float*)Gl.MapBuffer(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, BufferAccessARB.ReadOnly);

            for (int i = 0; i < NUM_INVOCATIONS; i++)
            {
                 Console.WriteLine(returnValues[i]);
            }

            comnputeShaderTest = new CShader(Gl, "shader.comp");
            comnputeShaderTest.Use();
            uint ssboIndex = Gl.GenBuffer();
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.BufferData<float>(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, vertices, BufferUsageARB.DynamicDraw);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.DispatchCompute((uint)NUM_INVOCATIONS, 1, 1);
            Gl.MemoryBarrier(MemoryBarrierMask.ShaderStorageBarrierBit);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);

            float* returnValues = (float*)Gl.MapBuffer(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, BufferAccessARB.ReadOnly);

            for (int i = 0; i < NUM_INVOCATIONS; i++)
            {
                 Console.WriteLine(returnValues[i]);
            }

            comnputeShaderTest = new CShader(Gl, "shader.comp");
            comnputeShaderTest.Use();
            uint ssboIndex = Gl.GenBuffer();
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.BufferData<float>(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, vertices, BufferUsageARB.DynamicDraw);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.DispatchCompute((uint)NUM_INVOCATIONS, 1, 1);
            Gl.MemoryBarrier(MemoryBarrierMask.ShaderStorageBarrierBit);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);

            float* returnValues = (float*)Gl.MapBuffer(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, BufferAccessARB.ReadOnly);

            for (int i = 0; i < NUM_INVOCATIONS; i++)
            {
                 Console.WriteLine(returnValues[i]);
            }

            comnputeShaderTest = new CShader(Gl, "shader.comp");
            comnputeShaderTest.Use();
            uint ssboIndex = Gl.GenBuffer();
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.BufferData<float>(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, vertices, BufferUsageARB.DynamicDraw);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);
            Gl.DispatchCompute((uint)NUM_INVOCATIONS, 1, 1);
            Gl.MemoryBarrier(MemoryBarrierMask.ShaderStorageBarrierBit);
            Gl.BindBufferBase(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, 0, ssboIndex);

            float* returnValues = (float*)Gl.MapBuffer(BufferTargetARB.ShaderStorageBuffer, BufferAccessARB.ReadOnly);

            for (int i = 0; i < NUM_INVOCATIONS; i++)
            {
                 Console.WriteLine(returnValues[i]);
            }

I

Invar•10/30/22, 4:15 PM

The above snippet with my shader.comp snippet should be a complete working example of passing a ssbo to computer shader, modifying it and retrieving its value.

MMrTwix Hi, I'm new to Silk.NET and was wondering what the third parameters of the KeyDo...

S

Spec-Chum•10/30/22, 4:28 PM

I can't see anything either - I had assumed it was a modifier, like to check if Shift etc was pressed, but I'm not sure - even the keyboard tests have it as a discard

M

MrTwix•10/30/22, 4:28 PM

mmm

M

MrTwix•10/30/22, 4:29 PM

https://github.com/dotnet/Silk.NET/issues/185
this post mentioned it not being a modifier. im not clear on what they're saying it is tho

GitHub

Expected 3rd param of KeyDown/KeyUp to be the modifiers · Issue #18...

The 3rd param of the glfw KeyDown/KeyUp events is the code instead of the modifiers. Is this on purpose? I expected it to be the modifiers. Or do I have to create key modifiers on my own through Is...

MMrTwix https://github.com/dotnet/Silk.NET/issues/185 this post mentioned it not being a...

S

Spec-Chum•10/30/22, 4:30 PM

I've got it - just ran a test

M

MrTwix•10/30/22, 4:31 PM

what is it

S

Spec-Chum•10/30/22, 4:31 PM

raw input

S

Spec-Chum•10/30/22, 4:31 PM

pressing Q, W, E, R, T... gives you:

S

Spec-Chum•10/30/22, 4:31 PM

I'm just saying there's many ways that the usability of a "engine" I write might not matter at all,

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