@walmis where does the estop go or does it just interrupt the psu? If it's turning off the psu, do t

@walmis where does the estop go or does it just interrupt the psu? If it's turning off the psu, do the encoders lose power too? How about the grip/spi?

Someone asked if the axes still track when the motors are powered down and I've wondered since.

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 5:25 AM

hm, so it's definitely not existing pcb.
though thinking of it - in any case it's a bit sad news. I believe in any case you can't just copy someone's pcb and number of existing pcb are quite limited, so you can't use that approach to solve troll issue

mechsickoOP•2/14/23, 5:28 AM

I have no idea what that means but there is no patent troll thing and people are free to use DirectInput

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 5:28 AM

well, in that case VKB would build their ffb base long time ago

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 5:29 AM

I think these assholes even sue people for vibro feedback in controllers

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 5:32 AM

yeah, nintendo are actually paying them for the fact that switch vibrates when you use touch screen.......

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 5:33 AM

that is such a bullshit...

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 5:35 AM

though I also heard some news that these patents were expired recently... like this summer or something

DrQuinn•2/14/23, 5:46 AM

These guys hold all the patents. https://www.immersion.com

DDeadlyMercury well, in that case VKB would build their ffb base long time ago

walmis•2/14/23, 5:47 AM

They're building their TECS though

Mmechsicko @walmis where does the estop go or does it just interrupt the psu? If it's turni...

walmis•2/14/23, 5:48 AM

Yeah, it cuts power positive wire going to the motors. Position feedback will not work, but usb powered stuff like Grip will continue to work.

DDeadlyMercury Several questions though: 1) how loud is it? There are several fans for cooling ...

walmis•2/14/23, 5:50 AM

To answer 1) It's silent, unless you're dogfighting and motors go above 50degC, fans are 60mm ones, not super loud.

Wwalmis They're building their TECS though

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 6:01 AM

uhm... throttle with ffb?
I'm looking at it but it seems nothing related to ffb at all.

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 6:01 AM

(pedals with ffb when btw lol)

walmis•2/14/23, 6:02 AM

You could implement the motor kit into existing pedals though

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 6:03 AM

yeah, maybe in the future because pedals with trimming would be fantastic

DDeadlyMercury uhm... throttle with ffb? I'm looking at it but it seems nothing related to ffb ...

walmis•2/14/23, 6:04 AM

It's more like haptic throttle with electronic detents, auto movement, etc. Basically subset of FFB.

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 6:05 AM

hm, interesting. But I guess no sims supports that and try to move your throttle

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 6:05 AM

hm, but still that's cool

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 6:06 AM

"moving throttle" is one thing and possibly useless, at least for military planes. But having the same device that works differently and for example on one aircraft provides smooth 0-100% while on the other aircraft provides smooth 0-80% and then tactile "bump" for afterburner...

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 6:08 AM

or even larger "bump" to simulate breaking wire for WEP or something

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 6:08 AM

damn

walmis•2/14/23, 6:08 AM

Yeah, once you have the actuators in, you can make it work anyhow you want via software.

walmis•2/14/23, 6:09 AM

For example it could be possible to make a Rhino into a gear shifter lol.

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 6:09 AM

"shut up and take my money wait I don't have such amount of money for everything"

DDeadlyMercury well, in that case VKB would build their ffb base long time ago

PiNKSH!T•2/14/23, 7:34 AM

pretty sure there's a video out there (quick search & I can't find the forum it's on) but basically someone is trying to get the vkb owner to understand the need/benefits of ffb & they even take him on a flight, at the end of the video he still doesn't change his mind on ffb joysticks being a benefit for immersion etc.

PiNKSH!T•2/14/23, 7:42 AM

also the main things that killed ffb joysticks were; more & more games other than flight sims not using joysticks anymore, at around the same time flight sim popularity took a massive dive in the early 2000's, so less games using joysticks, less people playing the sims that still used it & then there's always the factor not everyone wanted a ffb joystick. I believe the patent troll "Immersion Corp" had a small hand in it also being that anyone that did want to make a ffb joystick using any of those designs would also have to pay for the patent. So ffb ended up being a niche product in a niche market & that's not something big companies that could afford a patent fee want to get into & it's enough to keep out small companies. The whole patent troll thing is arguable about it's effects from what I've seen on the subject.

DDrQuinn These guys hold all the patents. https://www.immersion.com

aniron•2/14/23, 7:59 AM

They expired.
https://www.reddit.com/r/hotas/comments/bmnr8f/as_of_today_immersion_corps_force_feedback/

r/hotas - As of today, Immersion Corp's Force Feedback patents have...

79 votes and 22 comments so far on Reddit

Wwalmis They're building their TECS though

PiNKSH!T•2/14/23, 8:40 AM

I have a really fun game I play were whenever I find the TECS mentioned I tell ppl that it was a joke from VKB that got out of hand & there isn't really a TECS being built. It's so funny to see the reactions of ppl, some believe me, some don't & get angry & most just laugh

walmis•2/14/23, 8:41 AM

Also TECS get's delayed by 2 weeks everytime it's mentioned. TECS.

Wwalmis For example it could be possible to make a Rhino into a gear shifter lol.

PiNKSH!T•2/14/23, 8:47 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aOr4thXyqA&ab_channel=PcmciaKai FF Shifter is the software

YouTubePcmciaKai

FFShifter in LFS (MS Force Feedback 2)

I set up my Microsoft Force Feedback 2 with the FFShifter program by Andreas Panos and drove in "Live For Speed". Note, that I didn't concentrate at all on driving, in next videos I will think of a way to mount my phone cam. :P

Get LFS:
http://www.lfs.net/

Download FFShifter:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1suH_XfhFalpkX6zTDx5uqS1HxDTkRu9e/v...

PPiNKSH!T pretty sure there's a video out there (quick search & I can't find the forum it'...

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 9:17 AM

pretty opposite though

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 9:17 AM

after that flight he said that yeah, ffb is a must

DeadlyMercury•2/14/23, 9:18 AM

and because of that there was a hope

AndyHill•2/14/23, 11:27 AM

FFB never really went away if you include steering wheels in the mix

AndyHill•2/14/23, 11:29 AM

the big problem with flight sim FFB was the choice of hardcore hotas stuff such as cougars, warthogs & CH stuff vs. typically simpler ffb sticks

AndyHill•2/14/23, 11:30 AM

when you split a small niche of hardcore weirdos who would potentially buy an ffb stick into stick functions vs ffb groups, there's not very many left to keep force stuffs going

Andesh•2/14/23, 12:40 PM

Wow.. i just found this today.. lovely initiative. i've been wanting my own force-feedback stick now for a couple of years... my brother had one back in the day.. i tried to figure out the price by looking in the FAQ section but i couldn't work it out.. any indication how much we're looking at here?

Kruger•2/14/23, 12:54 PM

What is the price of the VPforce RHIINO FFB Base?
The RHINO costs 800€ + shipping

The first line of the FAQ
Or do you mean a motorsez

Andesh•2/14/23, 12:55 PM

umm.. is the 800euro with motors or not?

Andesh•2/14/23, 12:55 PM

or are the motors som option?

Kruger•2/14/23, 1:08 PM

800 for a rhino

Please read the FAQ carefully for further information

AAndesh umm.. is the 800euro with motors or not?

walmis•2/14/23, 1:09 PM

This is for the complete, plug-and-play base (without grip)

PiNKSH!T•2/14/23, 1:39 PM

Has anyone here got any experience with Komodo Simulations sim gear?

PPiNKSH!T Has anyone here got any experience with Komodo Simulations sim gear?

Anthony•2/14/23, 1:50 PM

Yeah, it’s frankly awful

Anthony•2/14/23, 1:50 PM

Spent only €100 less than what a Rhino base would cost for a B8 cyclic and base

Anthony•2/14/23, 1:51 PM

The base couldn’t keep the cyclic in place as advertised, and the grip was sub Saitek quality

Anthony•2/14/23, 1:52 PM

I’ve not heard of a single satisfied Komodo customer in the ten years since that disappointing experience

AAnthony Yeah, it’s frankly awful

PiNKSH!T•2/14/23, 2:02 PM

Ahh ok I checked them out a while back maybe 2 yrs & just having a look again now it seem they've changed the 3d printing they used to have for a nylon/resin print, looks a bit better quality. The price is crazy though! It's just a shame cause they have such a good collection, the Apache collective & cyclic grips & the ones for the Kiowa would be great to have. Shame their collective/cyclic grips don't use the thrustmaster style connection & could work with Virpil collective/joystick bases. I'd love to have a VPforce adapter for their joystick grips to fit the RHINO base.

Anthony•2/14/23, 2:05 PM

I suppose it’s easy to offer a wide range of products if you don’t have too many qualms about quality

AAnthony I suppose it’s easy to offer a wide range of products if you don’t have too many...

PiNKSH!T•2/14/23, 2:06 PM

yeah for sure, can't understand how they justify such high prices too if the quality is so bad, like if the money isn't going into high quality buttons & switches then where? lol

@walmis where does the estop go or does it just interrupt the psu? If it's turning off the psu, do t

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