On a totally different subject - I think there's a couple of people looking for this (and sorry, @Bo

On a totally different subject - I think there's a couple of people looking for this (and sorry, @Bob Bushman you seem to be saying this isn't possible) but I think I've found a pretty good facsimile for the F16 force sensing stick...

My understanding of the F16 stick is that it does have SOME movement (and it's a shame the software endstops can't be made lower than 10%) but this appears to work bloody well in my mind

RoyMi6OP•1/8/24, 9:44 PM

(actually, spring gain isn't 100%, I have it controlled by the hardware pot and it's maybe only quater way up, just so the stick recenters well)

Bob Bushman•1/8/24, 9:44 PM

Contrary to popular belief, no man has died from eating his pride.

If you're right it saves me another 1k

RoyMi6OP•1/8/24, 9:45 PM

haha - yeah, try it out - with the endstops at 10% you defintly don't want an extension - but I'm of the understanding that the sidestick in the F16 doesn't IRL either

Bob Bushman•1/8/24, 9:49 PM

Running extension less center mount at the moment, but will definitely give this a whirl

Fierce_Fire•1/8/24, 9:49 PM

Doesnt the f16 feel wierd with ffb for you?

Bob Bushman•1/8/24, 9:52 PM

Havent actually tried it yet

RoyMi6OP•1/8/24, 9:57 PM

I mean for me... I haven't flown a real F16... so with nothing to compare against

Fierce_Fire•1/8/24, 9:59 PM

It doesnt feel like how the springs in the f18, f15e or apache feel

Number481•1/9/24, 12:26 AM

Big TelemFFB Release News

@Rhino Owner @FFB/Kit Owner @VPforce
For the past 2 months or so (seems longer?), @smitty and I have been working hard in the background to completely revamp TelemFFB.

The effects aspect of TelemFFB have seen a lot of development, but the UI and configurability have always been a flat spot.

A big thanks to @smitty, who took the initiative to start working on a dynamic, graphical settings interface which necessitated a ground-up re-write of the entire configuration model and many, many enhancements and modifications to the overall TelemFFB UI.

You can grab the latest version over in Unknown. If you are already running the 'WiP' version (which most everyone is), you should automatically get the update the next time you start TelemFFB.

I won't bore you with too many gory details, but here are the high points:

Completely UI driven config (no more ini files!)
- Only valid/applicable settings are shown when modifying a sim/aircraft category/aircraft (no more guessing)
- Live effect management for active aircraft right from the TelemFFB window
- Manage any sim / aircraft category / specific aircraft default settings through the settings manager interface
- Simple, wizard-based creation of settings for new aircraft (either 'new' or 'clone from existing')
Easy operation for multiple FFB devices (i.e. joystick plus pedals and/or collective)
- Built in Auto-launch setup for multiple devices (no more need for command line arguments!)
- Dynamically manage unique config for any device from single master window
Automatic management of user settings override for all sims and FFB devices
Automated, built-in, legacy user override file (.ini) conversion

I urge you to review the new section of the manual here, paying particularly close attention to the "what's different" and "first time setup" sections: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1YL5DLkiTxlaNx_zKHEYSs25PjmGtQ6_WZDk58_SGt8Y/edit#bookmark=id.og67qrvv8gt7

If you are running currently with multiple devices, you will certainly want to review the section covering that setup in the new version: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1YL5DLkiTxlaNx_zKHEYSs25PjmGtQ6_WZDk58_SGt8Y/edit#heading=h.vq9olbg3m4ll

This is a pretty big boulder we just tossed in the 'pond of stability' of TelemFFB. So as more people get their hands on it, there will certainly be some unforeseen bugs or features/settings that are broken or missing... so, please, if you notice something please let us know!. We have squashed many bugs over the past several weeks of cleanup and polishing, bug you can never get them all!

Enjoy!
Here's some screenshots I leaked the other day:

FFierce_Fire Doesnt the f16 feel wierd with ffb for you?

PiNKSH!T•1/9/24, 7:54 AM

I think there was talk about trying (in the future) to emulate force sensing with the rhino's ffb? I'd love to see where this goes, I still plan on getting the winwing fssb but it'd be a good excuse for a second rhino! lol

PPiNKSH!T I think there was talk about trying (in the future) to emulate force sensing wit...

RoyMi6OP•1/9/24, 8:56 AM

That’s what these settings get close too 📃general

RRoyMi6 On a totally different subject - I think there's a couple of people looking for ...

原

原子力Hoshino•1/9/24, 9:03 AM

interesting! so with this setting, it would require max stick force you've set for reaching 10% end stop, correct? Also maybe it's also a good idea that having the hardware throw limiter of 10% end stop to assist the software one, just in case you apply too much force and over come the software endstop

原原子力Hoshino interesting! so with this setting, it would require max stick force you've set f...

RoyMi6OP•1/9/24, 9:43 AM

Yeah, it’s the spring that controls that, and I have the spring force configured be the potentiometer on the base (and it’s only about a quarter turn) so it’s not actually running at full 100%. But it’s a combination of settings worth trying. I think having the software endstops being slightly less would be better, but the lowest they go is 10% currently. I agree that having hardware ends stops would likely be beneficial to reduce load on the motor. For this you’d probably want to turn on Endstops but reduce the actual force power to 0%

VPforceBot•1/9/24, 10:19 AM

RHINO #0336 Has Shipped!

VPforceBot•1/9/24, 10:19 AM

RHINO #0335 Has Shipped!

Boggy•1/9/24, 12:15 PM

Wow, this new telemetry thingy is awesome! Everything feels so much better in DCS!

Fudge•1/9/24, 12:20 PM

Has anyone stuck a couple of motors into an original cockpit yet? Current plan was springs but I've always wanted to play with a ffb yoke. I've seen a few desktop style yoke projects which look really neat.

NNumber481 # Big TelemFFB Release News @Rhino Owner @FFB/Kit Owner @VPforce For the past 2...

Snubblaren•1/9/24, 12:42 PM

how do i get the tabs all i se is this?

smitty•1/9/24, 12:43 PM

that's the 'stable' version, you want the 'wip'

SSnubblaren how do i get the tabs all i se is this?

Number481•1/9/24, 12:44 PM

grab the latest version in #VPforce-TelemFFB which is linked in the above post

Number481•1/9/24, 12:45 PM

either the last post from the github bot or from the downloads site in the pinned messages

NNumber481 grab the latest version in #VPforce-TelemFFB which is linked in the above post

Snubblaren•1/9/24, 12:47 PM

Thanks

NNumber481 grab the latest version in #VPforce-TelemFFB which is linked in the above post

Bob Bushman•1/9/24, 12:49 PM

That just says "unknown" meaning I don't have access to the channel

Bob Bushman•1/9/24, 12:51 PM

Seems discord was having a db hiccup

RRoyMi6 On a totally different subject - I think there's a couple of people looking for ...

Bob Bushman•1/9/24, 2:22 PM

Just gave this a whirl and must say it feels quite interesting, a bit nervous perhaps, and I noticed after a flight and tweaking some more settings, if I have my pot or spring settings at around 25% it's fine, but increase it much and pull to max, and then release quickly will trip the motor, mostly my y axis (but this could probably vary) somewhere around 30-40% it would likely trip easily.

BBob Bushman Just gave this a whirl and must say it feels quite interesting, a bit nervous pe...

RoyMi6OP•1/9/24, 2:28 PM

ah yeah, I noticed that once too. I thought I had set something wrong somewhere. Yeah, I know what you mean. Feels like you have to be gentle with it, but I suppose that's what you get from software endstops. As @7hoshino suggested, these settings with hardware endstops would likely work quite well. As you wouldn't be relying on the motors to provide that functionality they would likely have more capacity to act like a strong spring

Bob Bushman•1/9/24, 2:30 PM

Don't think I need much more than a spring force of 25% either so

, If making endstops I imagine they would need be less than the minimum 10%, but having these would naturally hamper other modules

smitty•1/9/24, 2:31 PM

adjust friction & damping so that it doesnt go crazy when you release quickly.. might not be able to totally remove the oscillation though

ddrake1984•1/9/24, 2:31 PM

something I have been meaning to do, get some endstops made.. does anyone know where the 3d files are for them?

Bob Bushman•1/9/24, 2:32 PM

Definitely feels like a very neat way to fly the viper, and never noticed this during flight, just after and while "messing around"

Dddrake1984 something I have been meaning to do, get some endstops made.. does anyone know w...

RoyMi6OP•1/9/24, 2:35 PM

https://discord.com/channels/965234441511383080/1092338475795238962

ddrake1984•1/9/24, 2:35 PM

thanks

FFudge Has anyone stuck a couple of motors into an original cockpit yet? Current plan w...

N7783L•1/9/24, 2:36 PM

To use when flying a real airplane or for use in a cockpit being turned into a stationary cockpit?

BBob Bushman Don't think I need much more than a spring force of 25% either so 🤷, If making ...

RoyMi6OP•1/9/24, 2:36 PM

defintely an nice to have would be a variable endstop... like a peice that allows you to slide in endstops without having to replace the whole boot every time...

ddrake1984•1/9/24, 2:36 PM

going to make endstops for F18

RRoyMi6 defintely an nice to have would be a variable endstop... like a peice that allow...

ddrake1984•1/9/24, 2:37 PM

I was thinking of making the boot attach with neodymium magnets

ddrake1984•1/9/24, 2:38 PM

this way you can remove it easily enough and replace the endstops

NN7783L To use when flying a real airplane or for use in a cockpit being turned into a s...

Fudge•1/9/24, 2:39 PM

It will be a simulator, the plane crashed years ago so it'll never be airworthy again.

Dddrake1984 this way you can remove it easily enough and replace the endstops

RoyMi6OP•1/9/24, 2:39 PM

yeah, gotcha, just lift up the boot cover and unscrew the endstops

FFudge It will be a simulator, the plane crashed years ago so it'll never be airworthy ...

N7783L•1/9/24, 2:44 PM

Then you’re facing something approximately like what my rig looks like. I built my sim pit a lot like an airplane with a stick so now have to figure out how to add VPF to a fairly plane-like mechanism. It looks like you’re interfacing to yokes. There was at least one example of that here a while back but I forget who posted it. Maybe someone else remembers but it looked pretty good.

NN7783L Then you’re facing something approximately like what my rig looks like. I built ...

Fudge•1/9/24, 2:48 PM

I've searched the discord for "yoke" and most are compact designs.

I've got an advantage of cables that would usually lead between the controls and flight surfaces still being present.

The most basic idea would be to join the cable ends around a sprocket attached to the motor and basically see what happens.

smitty•1/9/24, 2:57 PM

if you have cables, take a look at my TPR mod in #

knowledge-base - measure how much linear movement you have on the cable and make a pulley with diameter = {measurement}/pi

Ssmitty if you have cables, take a look at my TPR mod in #📙knowledge-base - measure ho...

Fudge•1/9/24, 3:08 PM

I was having a read last night, your design work is great. I've generally been more trial and error so it's fascinating to see things designed properly.

FFudge I've searched the discord for "yoke" and most are compact designs. I've got an ...

原

原子力Hoshino•1/9/24, 5:28 PM

a while ago someone was discussing how to add the motors into the existing control system on a homecockpit made from a real F-15 cockpit.. it's using stick in stead of yoke tho

around here https://discord.com/channels/965234441511383080/1145651561578647582/1183878971725709373

Mongo•1/9/24, 5:38 PM

So, for those of y'all that did the DIY rudder pedals/collective, how did you guys do it? Did you start with an existing peripheral like MFGs or Virpil pedals and mount the motors onto that or did you do a completely custom peripheral, up to programming your own control boards?

Fierce_Fire•1/9/24, 5:39 PM

People made ffb throttles?

PPiNKSH!T I think there was talk about trying (in the future) to emulate force sensing wit...

Monkee•1/9/24, 5:39 PM

I don't want to discount the idea at all, because it's great to do whatever we want with FFB bases but I wonder if it's not better to have a "normal" ffb even for this plane. In the end, the FFB is supposed to compensate for all the seat-of-the-pants info we are not having, aren't we losing them if we replicate a FSSB?

FFierce_Fire People made ffb throttles?

Mongo•1/9/24, 5:40 PM

Meant collective. I saw it in the settings of the updated TelemFFB software and it piqued my interest.

Fierce_Fire•1/9/24, 5:40 PM

Ah yes that one

Mongo•1/9/24, 5:40 PM

In my head, it's a short step from FFB collective to FFB throttles