@Hiob before you installed the gimbal in the enclosure, did the oval-shaped X and Y gimbal frames ro

@Hiob before you installed the gimbal in the enclosure, did the oval-shaped X and Y gimbal frames rotate freely and smoothly around the grip connector?

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:21 AM

I think mine was overtightened. My gimbal frames barely moved at all, took a lot of force to rotate them

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:22 AM

ie. the main nut, sitting all the way down in the core of the grip connector

Nnubbins @Hiob before you installed the gimbal in the enclosure, did the oval-shaped X an...

Hiob•7/5/24, 8:25 AM

Yes and no - there is a bit of a "round edge" when you try to deflect both axis at the same time. This is a geometrical thing due to how the gimbal works. Once you add an extension and grip this (very small) hump isn't there anymore (or can't be felt anymore). The inner oart of the stick connector needs o rotate slightly inside the outer part and also needs to move up and down (very very slightly) - that is what the flexible TPU part is for. A bit like a spinal disc. But without any weight and leverage, it can be felt.

Nnubbins I think mine was overtightened. My gimbal frames barely moved at all, took a lot...

Hiob•7/5/24, 8:26 AM

That your gimbal was hard to rotate isn't right though

Hiob•7/5/24, 8:26 AM

It should move easily.

Hiob•7/5/24, 8:27 AM

Perhaps the bearings weren't properly seated?

HHiob Yes and no - there is a bit of a "round edge" when you try to deflect both axis ...

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:27 AM

yes, it's that second type of rotation that I mean. Was it smooth? Or did it take a lot of force
I took a picture on day 1 and X/Y frames were slightly crooked, which had me a bit concerned not because it was crooked, but because it was very hard to rotate to get aligned again

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:27 AM

it did not feel like there was a bearing in there at all. More like just a screw and nut.

Hiob•7/5/24, 8:27 AM

"A lot of force" - certainly not!

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:27 AM

Which I now understand looking at the subsonic guide that there are back to back flanged bearings in there

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:28 AM

I suppose if it was assembled like that, then two weeks of use under high spring force might have broken something

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:28 AM

since yesterday i've loosened the nut a bit, but it seems to be too late

Hiob•7/5/24, 8:28 AM

I'm thinking more of the big bearings that hold the main gimbal frames.

HHiob I'm thinking more of the big bearings that hold the main gimbal frames.

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:29 AM

the big outer 6808s? hmmm they are still pretty smooth but i'll check next week

Hiob•7/5/24, 8:29 AM

If those aren't perfectly seated - aka not perpendicular to the axis of rotation, it could make the whole assemble get stuck

Hiob•7/5/24, 8:31 AM

To give you an idea - When I disassembled the gimbal to change the stick connector to my "stubby" version - after reassembling and only the 80mm grip connector as a "lever" - without belts attached, the gimbal moved freely and buttery smooth in every direction.

HHiob To give you an idea - When I disassembled the gimbal to change the stick connect...

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:34 AM

with no belts attached, the gimbal has always been pretty smooth in linear x and y motion, no issues with the 6808 bearings there

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:34 AM

but with circular motion it has always had some issues with internal creaking that can be felt all the way up the grip

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:34 AM

probably at the beginning due to the grossly overtightened nut, maybe now due to internal damage

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:35 AM

oh well........the belts weren't expensive, at least

Hiob•7/5/24, 8:38 AM

You shouldn't overthighten the central bolt that connects the two core parts. I would even argue, that the bolt doesn't need to be fixated in the outer part at all - but I haven't tried that yet.

HHiob You shouldn't overthighten the central bolt that connects the two core parts. I ...

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:39 AM

i'll certainly keep that in mind for the gimbal rebuild

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:39 AM

would honestly be helpful if there was a guide out there for how tight the main screws need to be

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:39 AM

the main bolt/nut of grip connector and core joint, the preload screws, etc.

Hiob•7/5/24, 8:44 AM

For the free moving variant I have in mind, you would need a different outer core and bearings though. The "stock" gimbal works just fine. It is mainly the central bolt that connects the gimbal core that can't be overtightend.

nubbinsOP•7/5/24, 8:45 AM

hold on, are you using a 72T pulley? in combination with 12T motor pulley

Hiob•7/5/24, 8:45 AM

Everything else can and should be "moderately hand tight" as far as I'm concerned

Nnubbins hold on, are you using a 72T pulley? in combination with 12T motor pulley

Hiob•7/5/24, 8:45 AM

Me? Yeah the default one - 74T I think

HHiob You can also move the center point by altering the calibration values. I don't k...

kaltokri•7/5/24, 9:47 AM

Nope. I don't find anything in the configurator. I don't want a curvature in the force of the axis. I want a curvature in the value of the axis.

Kkaltokri Nope. I don't find anything in the configurator. I don't want a curvature in the...

Hiob•7/5/24, 9:52 AM

I see. Well, generally speaking - that is undesirable with force feedback. Because a non-linear physical to logical position would mess up the ffb-effects (afaik). However - if it is the stick position in the forward trim that is concerning you, it may be worth considering to move the center point towards you, by manually changing the calibration value of the "push forward" position. I did that for the F-4 once, because it has a lot of forward trim and my arm was to short for comfort. Probably not exactly what you are looking for, but it may help to alleviate your problem.

walmis•7/5/24, 9:57 AM

Yeah curves + dynamic trim offset doesn't make sense. I've researched into that last year
📃general

Wwalmis so the TM grip works, but others not?

AlexS•7/5/24, 11:36 AM

Yes

AAlexS Yes

walmis•7/5/24, 12:05 PM

You can put a request: http://order.vpforce.eu I'll mail you another grip socket

Wwalmis You can put a request: http://order.vpforce.eu I'll mail you another grip socket

AlexS•7/5/24, 12:08 PM

Done. Thank you.

Wwalmis Yeah curves + dynamic trim offset doesn't make sense. I've researched into that ...

Number481•7/5/24, 1:08 PM

IMHO, even with regular sprung joysticks, curves are not the right solution to twitchy aircraft. Saturation works better. Unfortunately the saturation settings in DCS are also not compatible with FFB.

We have axis scaling in configurator, but it only allows for a positive saturation such that partial physical trave = full reported travel. It would also be useful to have negative capabilities such that full physical travel = partial reported travel.

You can accomplish this by manually increasing the calibrated range of the axis, but it would be nice to have a purpose built setting in configurator for doing so.

Wwalmis You can put a request: http://order.vpforce.eu I'll mail you another grip socket

AlexS•7/5/24, 3:00 PM

Amazing service mate, thank you.

kaltokri•7/5/24, 3:47 PM

I've found a workaround which make me happy until we found a better way.
I've described it here: https://discord.com/channels/965234441511383080/1098318539426889799/1258810327747924130
Maybe it is useful for other Hog drivers, too.

kaltokri•7/5/24, 3:50 PM

But I think it should be useful to place a tip in the manual to disable curvatures in DCS for A-10C & Ka-50 (and probably other chopper with trimmer).

Nnubbins that is the idea, but I'm not sure where I would go from there. To a different t...