I was bouncing around the idea on whether or not I should support D3D as well as Vulkan in this proj

I was bouncing around the idea on whether or not I should support D3D as well as Vulkan in this project but I'm still mixed about the idea given it'd be windows only

TechnicJelle•10/7/24, 7:26 PM

I have never cared one bit for DX, as I've always felt that cross-platform support is important

IiDrmzIt I was bouncing around the idea on whether or not I should support D3D as well as...

Aqua•10/7/24, 7:26 PM

you would also get xbox support

Aqua•10/7/24, 7:27 PM

although whether that is relevant or not is up to you. imo xbox will be pretty much dead in the waters by the next generation

Aqua•10/7/24, 7:27 PM

that may seem harsh but the disparity between the ps5 and xbox series x s series whatever idk what the names even are is quite large

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:28 PM

As much as I'm trying to not use platform specific code (which so far I've kept it up), consoles as a whole seem very anti-developer

Aqua•10/7/24, 7:28 PM

btw, i ain't no sony fan
... even though i somehow find myself owning a lot of playstations
but ms really seem to have screwed things
it's a shame too

IiDrmzIt As much as I'm trying to not use platform specific code (which so far I've kept ...

Aqua•10/7/24, 7:29 PM

they aren't pro developer, that's for sure. but yeah, they have biases towards AA/AAA devs rather than indies

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:29 PM

I've got my project running on Windows, Mac, Linux and Android atm but I don't have any consoles (besides a switch but uh, nintendo.)

Aqua•10/7/24, 7:29 PM

in ms's favour, last i've heard they are much more favourable towards indies than sony is. not sure about nintendo

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:30 PM

all I know is they're very picky about their SDKs

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:30 PM

and I kinda feel like the Switch wouldn't like C#

TechnicJelle•10/7/24, 7:30 PM

There are quite a few indie games on switch

Aqua•10/7/24, 7:31 PM

nativeaot should be able to run on any of the modern consoles nowadays

Aqua•10/7/24, 7:31 PM

i know the FNA guys got it working on all of them

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:31 PM

Oh right, I do need to ensure AOT still works on my project, which I think it does

TTechnicJelle There are quite a few indie games on switch

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:32 PM

I mean yeah, but like, how about engine wise?

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:32 PM

Most would be Unity I would assume

AAqua when you push opengl a bit, stuff that would run at 120fps on linux ran at like ...

Lyris the Kitori•10/7/24, 7:32 PM

AMD?

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:32 PM

Maybe the rare Godot

LLyris the Kitori AMD?

Aqua•10/7/24, 7:32 PM

don't quite recall, amd did perform significantly worse in opengl in general, although it's hard to know how much of that is down to thunderbolt 4

TechnicJelle•10/7/24, 7:33 PM

Yeah unity and Godot mostly

Lyris the Kitori•10/7/24, 7:33 PM

AMD OpenGL on windows is nerfed against linux because their windows GL drivers were built for workstation use, not gaming

Aqua•10/7/24, 7:33 PM

oh huh

TTechnicJelle Yeah unity and Godot mostly

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:33 PM

This makes me wonder with Unity 7 apparently going to CoreCLR how that will affect things

TechnicJelle•10/7/24, 7:34 PM

Same

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:34 PM

I also wonder if they're going to be deprecating a bunch of things as part of that fairly significant move

TechnicJelle•10/7/24, 7:34 PM

I don't particularly care for Unity (anymore) (though I never much did) but I gotta say, finally their promises are sounding like they come from having listened to what the people actually want

LLyris the Kitori AMD OpenGL on windows is nerfed against linux because their windows GL drivers w...

Aqua•10/7/24, 7:34 PM

that would explain why the disparity was massive on amd then, i couldn't even reach 60fps while rendering like 1000 cubes (i know a lot of that will also be due to my inefficient rendering system), while it reached like 100 on my laptop's significantly less powerful nvidia gpu

IiDrmzIt I also wonder if they're going to be deprecating a bunch of things as part of th...

TechnicJelle•10/7/24, 7:35 PM

I hope so

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:35 PM

One of my big criticisms of Unity had to come down to it's tech debt and also the rampant use of reflection

TechnicJelle•10/7/24, 7:35 PM

Mhm

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:35 PM

I found out Unity spends like 30% of a frame just verifying if methods exist?

AAqua that would explain why the disparity was *massive* on amd then, i couldn't even ...

Lyris the Kitori•10/7/24, 7:35 PM

yup
the AMD GL drivers on linux dont have this issue, and you'll see usually 30%-100% perf uplift

IiDrmzIt I found out Unity spends like 30% of a frame just verifying if methods exist?

TechnicJelle•10/7/24, 7:36 PM

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:36 PM

Something about finding if a particular MonoBehavior had Update/FixedUpdate etc

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:36 PM

(note they were never overrides)

TechnicJelle•10/7/24, 7:36 PM

Horrific

LLyris the Kitori yup the AMD GL drivers on linux dont have this issue, and you'll see usually 30%...

Aqua•10/7/24, 7:36 PM

i see, it all makes sense now
i thought it was just being bottlenecked by thunderbolt lol

TTechnicJelle Horrific

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:36 PM

It was never cached either

Lyris the Kitori•10/7/24, 7:37 PM

when valve initially ported L4D2 to linux natively back in like 2016, the perf on top of the line AMD OpenGL on linux was beating top of the line NVIDIA D3D9 lol

Aqua•10/7/24, 7:38 PM

yeah i remember reading that article, remember thinking that opengl was the superior api
haha, wrong

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:39 PM

Gotta love companies trying to smack down open source competitors I guess

Lyris the Kitori•10/7/24, 7:39 PM

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:39 PM

OpenGL on Windows v Linux

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:39 PM

Sounds like MS was intentionally trying to hurt it

Lyris the Kitori•10/7/24, 7:40 PM

thats not whats happening
AMD just has a low-performace-high-correctness GL driver on windows

Lyris the Kitori•10/7/24, 7:40 PM

it wasnt built for gaming

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:40 PM

Fair enough

iDrmzItOP•10/7/24, 7:41 PM

Hmm, maybe that's why when I was like, 12, Minecraft had such poor performance on the computer I had at the time

Lyris the Kitori•10/7/24, 7:41 PM

microsoft has a vested interest in keeping GL running well forever into the future, thats why win11 comes bundled with mesa to do GL->D3D12 translation

I was bouncing around the idea on whether or not I should support D3D as well as Vulkan in this proj

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