Heatblur simulation of the bellows system does not make much sense unless you have a stick 10x more

Heatblur simulation of the bellows system does not make much sense unless you have a stick 10x more powerful than stock Rhino, but it is what it is and we're stuck with it

MMichalK Heatblur simulation of the bellows system does not make much sense unless you ha...

TheAmazinGreat•1/13/25, 1:12 PM

How is the bellows system supposed to feel? What about the roll?

TheAmazinGreat•1/13/25, 1:14 PM

Having never flown the real thing or a real plane, I have no idea what anything is supposed to be like. So everything is just what feels right to me. But I’ve also always been on desk mounted spring centering sticks so I always wonder if that makes me biased to what feels right.

MichalKOP•1/13/25, 1:40 PM

More or less what Heatblur did, but much heavier overall. The real system works in a something like 0-60 kgf range, so it goes from "quite heavy" at takeoff speed to "very heavy" at high speed. But with the same force gradient that Heatblur copied from the real world, our joysticks go from "almost nothing" at takeoff speed, to "okay" at high speed.

MMichalK More or less what Heatblur did, but much heavier overall. The real system works ...

TheAmazinGreat•1/13/25, 1:46 PM

Sounds like then the overall implementation is good like you said. It’s just that because of the various forces available they gave us the gain adjustments. I understand now. I definitely feel the pitch get heavier at high speed. But have adjusted gain so it’s not too heavy.

TheAmazinGreat•1/13/25, 1:46 PM

Thanks for the explanation

Fr4Ged•1/13/25, 1:53 PM

Yeah, I am fine with the default forces. Don't want to destroy the gimbal. Lol

TTheAmazinGreat Sounds like then the overall implementation is good like you said. It’s just tha...

MichalKOP•1/13/25, 1:55 PM

The problem is that if you crank up the gain in DCS settings you can get 'okay' force at low speed, but quickly saturate ffb and loose the dynamics at high speed

VPforceBot•1/13/25, 1:56 PM

:package:

RHINO #0776 Has Shipped!

MichalKOP•1/13/25, 1:56 PM

The module would benefit from a different speed/gain curve, more in line with other DCS addons.

CapnFlint•1/13/25, 2:01 PM

I did end up putting a curve in an F4 specific VPForce config and using telem FFB to load that config when I fly the F4

FFr4Ged Yeah, I am fine with the default forces. Don't want to destroy the gimbal. Lol

Fierce_Fire•1/13/25, 2:18 PM

Good luck destroying it, it can take quite the punch

VPforceBot•1/13/25, 2:26 PM

:package:

RHINO #0855 Has Shipped!

VPforceBot•1/13/25, 2:26 PM

:package:

RHINO #0857 Has Shipped!

VPforceBot•1/13/25, 2:26 PM

:package:

RHINO #0856 Has Shipped!

MMichalK The module would benefit from a different speed/gain curve, more in line with ot...

TheAmazinGreat•1/13/25, 2:33 PM

But why have the gains at all, seems simple to say at X speed spring % is 50 and at y speed spring % is 100.

TheAmazinGreat•1/13/25, 2:33 PM

Would it be better to leave DCS gains at 100 and tune dynamic spring in VPconfig?

MichalKOP•1/13/25, 2:43 PM

well, that's an option too, play with rhino settings to alter spring gain there. The thing is that F-4 at 100% gain outputs only something around 10% FFB spring force at 200 kts, so you need to bump it considerably on the VPconfig side

MMichalK well, that's an option too, play with rhino settings to alter spring gain there....

TheAmazinGreat•1/13/25, 3:05 PM

So basically they’ve designed it for someone who has a FFB stick that can output 60kgf at max. And us mere mortals have to use the gains to try to bump the curve up to actually feel it.

MichalKOP•1/13/25, 3:09 PM

yep

VVPforceBot :package: 🇬🇧 **RHINO #0849** Has Shipped!

kiplet•1/13/25, 5:57 PM

This one's mine! Now I'm just sat patiently waiting for the VKB BlackBox to come back in stock on their European site (or better yet be sold on the UK site) so I can actually use it...

Kkiplet This one's mine! Now I'm just sat patiently waiting for the VKB BlackBox to come...

Blackrat•1/13/25, 6:02 PM

Mine is #854 UK too, was hoping for my Birthday, which is today, but its coming Wednesday which is my Wedding Anniversary, I bet my wife will be thrilled ....

BBlackrat Mine is #854 UK too, was hoping for my Birthday, which is today, but its coming ...

kiplet•1/13/25, 6:14 PM

Happy Birthday! A Rhino is the perfect wedding anniversary present for your wife, as it's sure to keep you out of her hair for longer.

Panzuur•1/13/25, 11:35 PM

Looking for advice and opinions, going to build a Rhino , collecting parts now, but am trying to decide which version, the Gadroc with 57BLF03 motors or go with TheAmazinGreat version with 86BLF04 motors, It looks like I may be able to mount either in my rig, but will require a 8 to 9 inch (220m) extension. I fly DCS Warbirds and with an extension that long have issues with the 57BLF03 motors overheating? I am leaning to the 86BLF04 motors because I could always turn the torque down, but what is the survivability of a 3d printed gimbal for a extension this long?

PPanzuur Looking for advice and opinions, going to build a Rhino , collecting parts now, ...

TheAmazinGreat•1/14/25, 1:40 AM

My extension is 250-300mm depending on where you measure from and haven’t had any issues with the gimbal. If you want some extra strength you can look into the Monster Rhino kits that @SR-FWinger[73]_David provides. He includes a laser sintered PA12 gimbal for some extra assurance.

TheAmazinGreat•1/14/25, 1:42 AM

I haven’t flown any warbirds on it but recently started learning the F4E. Before that, mostly the Hind. So not the biggest workout in terms of strength testing but it seems great. I also run mine at 75% spring setting so that equates to about 1.5x standard Rhino torque.

TTheAmazinGreat My extension is 250-300mm depending on where you measure from and haven’t had an...

SR-F_Winger_[73]_David•1/14/25, 6:16 AM

Both available now. Die to popular lower pricing demand i added the Option to Print the Gimbal from petg-cf and only have the connector in pa12

PPanzuur Looking for advice and opinions, going to build a Rhino , collecting parts now, ...

Fierce_Fire•1/14/25, 7:46 AM

FYI, the forces on the gimbal are close to the same for each motor/pulley combination, irrespective of what your extension is.

PPanzuur Looking for advice and opinions, going to build a Rhino , collecting parts now, ...

Hiob•1/14/25, 8:58 AM

Such an extension is used by a lot of Rhino users. (Including me). It isn't a problem for the Gimbal. It just reduces the max (pull-)force you can experience at the grip. So if you think that more is better, go for the Monster-Rhino. Otherwise the "small" Rhino is just fine.

Mike T•1/14/25, 10:01 AM

Can’t find any info in the VPF manual v0.81 on the VPF shift register …….where do I find the documentation on the use of this pcb? Ta

MMike T Can’t find any info in the VPF manual v0.81 on the VPF shift register …….where d...

walmis•1/14/25, 10:49 AM

Wire the serial interface like shown:
Each button has common GND, so connect each button to each pin on the shift register and other end to GND

Wwalmis Wire the serial interface like shown: Each button has common GND, so connect eac...

Mike T•1/14/25, 10:53 AM

Thanks, didn’t realise DI goes to DO on VP board.
Also how does it come up in the sim (like X- Plane), is it there you map the commands or do you map /bind commands in the VP configurator app?

walmis•1/14/25, 11:12 AM

It works as a regular shift-register input like the Thrustmaster grip, nothing fancy - just button inputs

Mike T•1/14/25, 11:41 AM

Ok thanks, will wire up and try it out…..

Chrisang•1/14/25, 3:28 PM

Hi !

Chrisang•1/14/25, 3:33 PM

Still on the waitlist but only one month left. So I prepare my pit. I intend to use a vkb grip with the vkb adapter but the question of the black box is not clear. According to the vkb site the black box is not required anymore since the mk IV serie does not need it. BTW the blackbox is out of stock. Looks like it's obsolete. Could someone clarify ? Thanks in advance

Wwalmis Nope, not a word yet

Anthony•1/14/25, 5:48 PM

Have you still not heard anything from them? Can't they send you the info/layout/details necessary if it's a long way off otherwise?

Anthony•1/14/25, 5:48 PM

(Just picked mine up, and man does it hurt having to put it back in the box until the FLNKR is integrated into the Rhino software

)

AAnthony Have you still not heard anything from them? Can't they send you the info/layout...

ReapDaddy•1/14/25, 8:23 PM

I'm surprised they didn't gift him one. Because well, Walmis...

RReapDaddy I'm surprised they didn't gift him one. Because well, Walmis...

Dracks•1/14/25, 8:36 PM

And folks, even though I understand what you're saying (and would love to see Walmis tinkering with our FLNKR profiles), we've got to remember that Virpil ships based on pre-orders. After all, I don't think they get an alert when he's ordered his grip

Dracks•1/14/25, 8:38 PM

And he'll surely have the same surprise as us when he sees that a parcel is being delivered

RReapDaddy I'm surprised they didn't gift him one. Because well, Walmis...

Anthony•1/14/25, 8:44 PM

Does sound a bit off that he should have to pay to make their product useful for more customers

Anthony•1/14/25, 8:44 PM

I mean, if it wouldn’t at some point become Rhino compatible, that’s a lot of VPC products which wouldn’t have been relevant to me

DDracks And folks, even though I understand what you're saying (and would love to see Wa...

ReapDaddy•1/14/25, 9:27 PM

Being Rhino owners we are pretty aware of pre-orders. Not even complaining about it. Just waiting for a shipping notice…

CChrisang Still on the waitlist but only one month left. So I prepare my pit. I intend to ...

kiplet•1/14/25, 9:50 PM

I think a BlackBox is still needed. I certainly need one for my VKB Gladiator EVO grip. They released a new BlackBox Mk3 version in the last year.
The US store has it, as does their Aliexpress store. But the Europe store has been out of stock for a while, and it doesn't list the Mk3 version.
I have my Rhino now, but unfortunately can't use it until the Europe store has the BlackBox back in stock. The VKB Aliexpress store doesn't ship to the UK any longer.

I'd check to see if the Aliexpress store ships to your country, and perhaps ask in the VKB discord about whether you need one for your particular grip.

DDracks And folks, even though I understand what you're saying (and would love to see Wa...

Anthony•1/14/25, 11:15 PM

To be fair, the FFBeast guy had an early copy sometime in November, maybe even October

Anthony•1/14/25, 11:16 PM

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/JAlv1c_xqjY?feature=share

YouTubePropeler3D

FFbeast VPC FLNK support #VPC #Flnkr #FFBeast

AAnthony To be fair, the FFBeast guy had an early copy sometime in November, maybe even O...

Dracks•1/15/25, 7:11 AM

Thanks for the link, I didn't see that last year.
My message wasn't meant to criticize or rant! I'd be the first happy to see Walmis rewarded or "sponsored" by manufacturers but I think that's up to him

. In any case, we're all looking forward to seeing him get his grip!!! Have a nice day

Kkiplet I think a BlackBox is still needed. I certainly need one for my VKB Gladiator EV...

Chrisang•1/15/25, 7:14 AM

@kiplet Thanks

Chrisang•1/15/25, 7:20 AM

I've just checked. VKB NA serves only US and Canada. Aliexpress is ok for France. I'll order there.

VPforceBot•1/15/25, 11:42 AM

:package:

RHINO #0858 Has Shipped!

Heatblur simulation of the bellows system does not make much sense unless you have a stick 10x more

Similar Threads