I got to thinking that If I fab a pair of bellcranks, I can put the stepper motors on a mounting pla

I got to thinking that If I fab a pair of bellcranks, I can put the stepper motors on a mounting plate fitted to one of the avionics bays right under the left side console.

Ff15sim I got to thinking that If I fab a pair of bellcranks, I can put the stepper moto...

mechsicko•9/22/23, 9:51 PM

Small correction: servo motors not steppers.

f15simOP•9/22/23, 9:57 PM

Steppers with feedback loops.

f15simOP•9/22/23, 9:57 PM

to me, servos are brushless things.

mechsicko•9/22/23, 10:28 PM

they are not only brushless dc servos they also have anti cogging profiles flashed on their custom integrated drive boards. Rhino is the real deal

f15simOP•9/22/23, 10:43 PM

I understand that - however, if they cog, they're not a brushless motor.

f15simOP•9/22/23, 10:44 PM

yes, it's another type of servo, but not what I would traditionally consider one. I'm used to brushless servos on CNC machines and in flight simulators.

ToreDL87•9/23/23, 4:52 AM

Received my Rhino today, #188.
Minus a wicked shimmy for a USB hub (my fault) and IL-2 controller interface (1C's fault) being far less than ideal, thanks to hands-on expertise by @walmis & @_gunzablazin I was able to get it up and running.
No pics because the 3 pieces of 3x8" I stacked up for a stand just does not do the Rhino justice (I expected another 3 months waiting time), but was able to do 12hrs worth of testing and breaking in flights at the IL-2 Flying Circus Flugpark server.

Not sure what I can say that other Rhino owners haven't said already.
Obviously the cogging I'm so used to with the old MSFFB2 and budget racing wheels just.. isn't there.
The stall & buffetting queue's are more like "next game" rather than "next level", they are specific to either side, and don't happen too late (which is the case with the MSFFB2), a.k.a a godsent in knife-edge fights: You can instantly correct the stall without missing a beat on your opponent.
Add to that, it easily has the smoothness and precision of a VKB/Virpil/Winwing, and them some, with more available throw, which aids in aerial gunnery.
And I haven't gotten around to fiddling with the adjustability of FFB sines/squares & endstops (throw), etc, adding a whole layer of (voluntary) complexity.

My hat is off to you walmis

Ff15sim Steppers with feedback loops. 😉

walmis•9/23/23, 9:47 AM

These motors are actually 3-phase brushless in a NEMA casing, so many people confuse these as steppers

Kreytfire•9/23/23, 10:39 AM

I tried out the TelemFFB yesterday and even I was already happy with the normal FFB delivered by DCS for the F14 and the stick forces (spring, damper, inertia) - I was blown away by what happened after installing the Telem!

Feeling the G forces and the engine, the VRS of the helicopters and so on and so on…. Last night I ended up flying warbirds, all kind of helos and jets till the sunrise just to explore this new world!
@walmis you Sir are a master and I am happy I ordered your Rhino, thank you!

KKreytfire I tried out the TelemFFB yesterday and even I was already happy with the normal ...

Simon2012•9/23/23, 11:12 AM

Would you mind sharing your settings ? Do you have an extension ?
I'm running a 20 cm extension, and I can't get anything satisfactory so far, it's always way too light

SSimon2012 Would you mind sharing your settings ? Do you have an extension ? I'm running a ...

walmis•9/23/23, 11:15 AM

Can you screenshot your settings?

Wwalmis Can you screenshot your settings?

Simon2012•9/23/23, 12:45 PM

Not at home for the next 10ish days, I'll do that when I'm back

Simon2012•9/23/23, 12:46 PM

But it's essentially the "regular" settings, with spring and inertia activated + spring gains adjusted as in the screenshot you posted above

DrQuinn•9/23/23, 3:11 PM

Plans on adding TelemFFB for MSFS/X-Plane as well? Great to see it available for DCS!

JIGGAwest•9/23/23, 3:20 PM

I believe it's already working for MSFS. You may have to activate a few settings in the config file

JIGGAwest•9/23/23, 3:22 PM

I haven't tested it personally, but it's on the plan for today.

Number481•9/23/23, 7:57 PM

TelemFFB supports DCS, MSFS and IL-2.
DCS/IL2 have native FFB support so TelemFFB is only adding effects.
For MSFS, TelemFFB is also handling dynamic stick forces since the sim doesn’t implement FFB at all.

Wwalmis These motors are actually 3-phase brushless in a NEMA casing, so many people con...

f15simOP•9/23/23, 8:00 PM

I thought brushless = no cogging (can't). Is this not the case?

Ff15sim I thought brushless = no cogging (can't). Is this not the case?

mechsicko•9/23/23, 8:15 PM

No. All slotted bldc have some cogging when unpowered due to permanent magnets. Slotless do not however both are subject to torque ripple that needs to be smoothed in the drive. Rhino bldc also have high res encoder to close the loop for torque/speed/position control. That is called a servo.

SSimon2012 Would you mind sharing your settings ? Do you have an extension ? I'm running a ...

Kreytfire•9/24/23, 12:27 AM

Sure, will do after the weekend but it’s all about fine tuning. I just had another flight with a friend sitting in the homepit and me doing all the changes - U probably have to adopt to the planes u fly in detail. For example: I just reduced the G-forces and disabled the AoA bouncer for the Tomcat as it gave me too much negative force on the stick and made it hard to control it in the AoA area u fly this bird. I am still new to the rhino, so maybe there is a better way for the setup - it’s try and error for your system. I am using a virpil Z extension and the VFX grip together with a Bergisson G-Seat and a homepit for the F14.

Kreytfire•9/24/23, 12:31 AM

Anyway, I can’t say it’s too light as I reduced the forces already quite a bit. Maybe work on your basic setup for the spring (80%) and the damper (25%). Inertia is set to 5% (but I think that inertia interacts with the damper, so I will set this to 0 I think.

Kreytfire•9/24/23, 12:35 AM

KKreytfire Sure, will do after the weekend but it’s all about fine tuning. I just had anoth...

Spatz•9/24/23, 12:06 PM

Can I ask you a bit about the G-Seat please - Was ist difficult to buid the G-seat ? How much do you spend? And how long took it for you to build it?

Spatz•9/24/23, 12:07 PM

And how is the general feeling is it worth the work?

Kreytfire•9/24/23, 5:09 PM

Build costs depend on the availability and the prices of the components. When I started the construction 10 months ago, some items were hard to get - what I‘ve seen, that is not an issue right now. Building it is not rocket-science but you need some skills (or learn it during the process) and some tools. It took me some months to finish it but I did not work on it all the time and I also had to wait for some crucial parts like motor controllers and the motors itself.
Yes, it’s worth it but I don’t turn it on all the time as my back (slipped spine) is not the best anymore and after, let’s say an hour, I need to get out. Some fine tuning is still ongoing - but again, I am not working on it very often right now as I have other „construction sites“ as well like the homepit, the rhino, the crystal and of course my house

Spatz•9/24/23, 6:15 PM

Hehe

understand - thanks for the answer ... I guess I will focus on the rhino and a motion platform for now and build the seat as a hobby project on the side because I don't have much time on my side as well

VPforceBot•9/25/23, 1:09 PM

:package:

RHINO #0203 Has Shipped!

Mack•9/25/23, 5:17 PM

So day three of having this thing. Wondering if folks could point me in the right direction to find this setting:

how to make it harder to pitch when you’re going really fast and the control surfaces are compressed. Thinking having to pull hard to get out of a dive. (Edit: is only fly DCS - warbirds, mirage f-1 mostly)

DrQuinn•9/25/23, 5:40 PM

Assume that is done via TelemFFB unless the aircraft has FFB enabled and setup for it.

DDrQuinn Assume that is done via TelemFFB unless the aircraft has FFB enabled and setup f...

Mack•9/25/23, 6:05 PM

I don’t see it in any DCS module.

DrQuinn•9/25/23, 6:10 PM

Look at the VPForce manual section 3.4.5.1

Mack•9/25/23, 6:17 PM

Ok. That’s close - not sure exactly the same as control surface compression. Like a p-51 in a dive is 1-G still but pulling out requires more force beaxuse of the air on the elevator. If I’m not mistaken.

Mack•9/25/23, 6:27 PM

This would be in addition to the g-loading once a turn is happening.

Mack•9/25/23, 6:32 PM

anyone disagree?

MMack Ok. That’s close - not sure exactly the same as control surface compression. L...

Number481•9/25/23, 6:33 PM

you're right that it is not exactly the same thing in that the math is derived from different data, but it is intended to approximate the same phenomenon. The faster you are going, the higher the g-loading will be with a given control input.

NNumber481 you're right that it is not exactly the same thing in that the math is derived f...

Mack•9/25/23, 6:34 PM

Thanks Champ!!

Number481•9/25/23, 6:39 PM

iirc, some aircraft (like the P-51) do implement some control tightening when coming out of a dive for example, but it is not configurable and doesn't achieve the forces that can be gained from the TelemFFB effect (which isn't perfect either, BTW)

Mack•9/25/23, 6:51 PM

Stupid question: but I don’t understand how to edit the TelemFFB values. Do I need to install python and edit a file that way?

MMack Stupid question: but I don’t understand how to edit the TelemFFB values. Do I ...

Number481•9/25/23, 6:54 PM

assuming you've downloaded the latest build from here: https://vpforcecontrols.com/downloads/TelemFFB/?C=M;O=A

I would suggest creating a copy of config.ini and name it config.user.iniconfig.user.ini. You can then use any text editor to edit your user config. Values in the user config will override the default values in the primary (config.ini) file.

Mack•9/25/23, 11:52 PM

So I need to enable effects in VP force config in order for the game or Telem FFB to use those types of effects? Said differently, can a game or telem FFB use effects if I don’t have an effect enabled in the configuration ? (DCS is my only game). Is this question clear?

SR-F_Winger_[73]_David•9/26/23, 8:29 AM

I if anyone reconsiders and wants to give up his spot please contact me. Ill take your spot. Lets work something out;)

VPforceBot•9/26/23, 9:56 AM

:package:

RHINO #0204 Has Shipped!

SSR-F_Winger_[73]_David I if anyone reconsiders and wants to give up his spot please contact me. Ill tak...

Spatz•9/26/23, 10:41 AM

The list will automatically be updated and the people waiting in line come next

MMack So day three of having this thing. Wondering if folks could point me in the rig...

MichalK•9/26/23, 10:48 AM

Just so you know, DCS warbirds have this effect already implemented to some extent by ED, while more modern aircraft usually do not do that in DCS nor in real life

MMack So I need to enable effects in VP force config in order for the game or Telem FF...

Number481•9/26/23, 11:38 AM

VPf configurator is the general config utility for the Rhino. It defines the maximum force capabilities for any of the effect categories like spring, periodic, damper, etc..

TelemFFB is %100 optional for DCS and is only a haptic effects generation app (things like engine rumble, gunfire, etc.). %99 of the effects are either periodic or constant force based, so those sliders in VPf configurator will define the maximum strength of those effects types.

Within the TelemFFB config, you set the intensity for each of the effects individually as a percentage of the maximum value. So if you had the periodic slider in configurator at 0, any effect in TelemFFB that is periodic based (most of them) would effectively be disabled.

I normally run my periodic slider at %50 and my constant force slider at %100.

MMichalK Just so you know, DCS warbirds have this effect already implemented to some exte...

Mack•9/26/23, 2:11 PM

Hmm. Ok. I think I’m doing something wrong then because I’m not feeling it.

MMack Hmm. Ok. I think I’m doing something wrong then because I’m not feeling it.

walmis•9/26/23, 2:18 PM

If you stall in TF-51 for example the stick most definitely should go limp during the stall.

Mack•9/26/23, 2:38 PM

I’ve done most of my testing on the spit, bf-109 and the mirage f-1. Which is what I fly mostly

NNumber481 VPf configurator is the general config utility for the Rhino. It defines the ma...

Mack•9/26/23, 2:40 PM

I’ll set mine to the same and keep playing.

MMack So day three of having this thing. Wondering if folks could point me in the rig...

Boggy•9/26/23, 3:02 PM

I'm trialling the MB339 and it has this. When you're slow the control stick feels kinda limp and as speed picks up it gets harder to move. Really nicely done. I don't recall any other module having this implement but could be wrong.

As a side note, my F5 feels crazy sensitive, despite having the same axis settings as other modules.

I got to thinking that If I fab a pair of bellcranks, I can put the stepper motors on a mounting pla

Similar Threads