Hm I thought as long as "Override Trim" isn't enabled this wouldn't be an issue. I will try this tod
Hm I thought as long as "Override Trim" isn't enabled this wouldn't be an issue. I will try this today.
PInteresting. I will definitely look thru my binds today.
NFor DCS, those settings won't take effect unless Override is enabled, as you say. The only things I can think if is if something is triggering the DCS "trim reset" binding when you release the force trim button. Also make sure you have no curves set in DCS. Curves and FFB do not get along.
PHere's the thing -- the re-centering is to the newly set center. So it's not continually retrimming.
NI dont understand. You push and hold the trim release, the spring forces go away. You move the stick, release the trim button, the forces come back centered at the new position. That is normal behavior.
PImagine if you installed the center trim system from the black shark into a jet. That's how it acts. The center changes, but it constantly tries to return to that center instead of acting like a cyclic.
NI guess I'm being thick and still dont understand. 'return to center', to me, means where the stick will settle whenyou let go.. that is the 'center of spring force'. Force trim, by its very nature, changes the center of the spring force to be wherever you want the trimmed position to be.
PSo I trim, the center changes. I pitch forward and take my hand off the stick and it snaps back to that center, rather than using that center as the new point of reference but acting like a cyclic where it stays where I leave it
PMaybe I'm not understanding how things should work. Here's what I thought: a helo's cyclic felt like a dead stick in terms of angle. Trimming simply sets a new center reference point. The force I should feel is aerodynamic effects (shudder, resistance, etc) and things like gunfire rumble and landing touchdowns.
PI.e. no snap-to-center effect
NHelicopters have a magnetic brake that holds the cyclic in a given position. This magnetic brake has springs with a a certain amount of range that you can fight against, but the cyclic will return to that position where the brake is holding it. If you want to move the resting (trimmed) position of the cyclic, you push and hold the force trim button, which disengages to magnetic brake and you are now free to move the cyclic wherever you want. When you release the button, the brake re-engages.
This is simulated in DCS by removing the spring force when you push and hold the trim button. When you release the button, it recalculates the new spring center point and re-applies the spring.
This is simulated in DCS by removing the spring force when you push and hold the trim button. When you release the button, it recalculates the new spring center point and re-applies the spring.
PInteresting 
PDoing a big think right now. This sounds like I've just been having a total misunderstanding of helos now that I've translated from non-ffb to the Rhino. Pre-Rhino I bought a cm3 base to get "dead stick" because that's how I understood people explaining a cyclic's behavior.
PNow I wish the Mongoose stick's thumb hat was a button instead. Too easy to move the hat in an unintended way rather than triggering a click on it.
NThe cyclic will, indeed, 'stay where you put it'.. its just that in a real helo, in order to 'put it', you user the force trim button to set where the mag-brake is holding the cyclic.
In a UH-1, with the force trim switch off (the only heli I know where you can disable the system).. the cyclic will not "purposefully " stay where you put it. You don't take your hand off the cyclic with force-trim disabled in the UH-1
In a UH-1, with the force trim switch off (the only heli I know where you can disable the system).. the cyclic will not "purposefully " stay where you put it. You don't take your hand off the cyclic with force-trim disabled in the UH-1
PMaybe I need to bind my trim to one of the hat directions, like right so I squeeze it into the stick. Hm. Will experiment.
NThe closest approximation you can get without FFB is a joystick base with a friction clutch.
PI get it now. Thank you so much for explaining it in context of how it works irl.
NI don't know what grip you have, but the thumb switch is a common button for the trim release (I see you said now)
P★ Cyrillic Button Labels
★ Based on Modern Russian Fighter Jet Controls
★ Material - Enhanced PU Plastic Construction
★ Wide Variety of Buttons, Triggers and Hats
★ Analogue Brake Lever
Due to the height of the grip, it is best suited for desk mounted/cockpit setups.
★ Based on Modern Russian Fighter Jet Controls
★ Material - Enhanced PU Plastic Construction
★ Wide Variety of Buttons, Triggers and Hats
★ Analogue Brake Lever
Due to the height of the grip, it is best suited for desk mounted/cockpit setups.
PPerfect in many ways for the Shark. Especially for the Shkval hat. Only thing I'd swap is the thumb hat for a single button.
PThe hat clicks, but that's a little finicky at that position ergonomically imo.
NThe alpha is the same way.. I've bound depress, forward and right all to the trim-release before (if you don't need the other directions for some other function, like in the Apache)
PI own an Alpha too. Great stick, but the twist always comes loose for me over time.
AHello guys,
Does anyone fly Mi-24 in DCS and have some good settings for Rhino? I can not find so goods settings for me. Maybe when I see another settings I will find something for me
Does anyone fly Mi-24 in DCS and have some good settings for Rhino? I can not find so goods settings for me. Maybe when I see another settings I will find something for me
AI use also TeleFFB but I think there are not so many effects for Mi-24, or I do something wrong
NWhat isn't working how you want it? There isn't anything in the way of flight forces feedback in a helicopter cyclic. FFB is pretty much limited to force trim (see conversation directly above). FFB Force Trim is implemented natively in DCS. Just adjust the spring and dapmen forces in VPforce configurator to your liking. TelemFFB is only used to add haptic effects like engine/rotor rumble, gunfire, damage effect, etc. etc.
AOk, so basic stetting is only damper and spring for heli, right? Or do you use another options with heli also?
ATelemFFB at this moment add effect only during damages or taxing, during shooting is nothing, engine also, I fly olny MI-24, maybe for Mi-24 is not implemented
AI found some settings for me, Spring around 15-20%, and damper for 70% but maybe someone has better setting, so I wanted to check it how someone else use available effects
NFor me, personally, I keep the spring at %100. It should be hard to move the cyclic unless you are holding down the force trim button. I keep damper around %20 just to give a little hydraulic feeling.. you dont want any high forces since you need to be able to make very microsopic adjustments.
AI will check it
AThanks a lot
NAll of the effects I mentioned (and more) should work with the Mi-24. The periodic effect slider in VPforce configurator controls the maximum intensity for any of these types of effects (usually keep at %50). There are individual intensity settings for all of these effects in the TelemFFB configuration file.
AWhat about effect of Instant trim mode? When I keep cyclic in position, I click trim and I ffb move the cyclic again, like in DCS when you use joy without ffb. In instant trim you have to fast go to neutral position to avoid it. How to minimalize it with FFB?
NMake sure you have FFB enabled in DCS settings.
AI have, checked it
NIf you have Force Feedback enabled in the DCS Misc. settings, and you have the helicopter trimmer set to Instant/default, it behaves differently than the same instant/default setting with a non-FFB joystick.
With non-FFB, as you say, you instantly get double input and need to return it to center. With FFB, that does not happen.
With non-FFB, as you say, you instantly get double input and need to return it to center. With FFB, that does not happen.
RCheck thumbsticks on controllers and vr controllers. I had the exact issue and it was a double bind in the axis x,y.
PEnded up just being me completely misunderstanding the intended behavior of a helicopter's cyclic. @Number481 fully explained it above. I'm all set now and loving it now that I'm not fighting how it works based on my former pre-ffb understanding of what to expect.
RExcellent
SI know it's a low priority but is there a way to get the RGB on the virpil constellation prime lit up with the rhino
3After doing the auto calibrate my stick wants to settle far forward when playing IL2 and the only way I can bring it to center is to adjust the FFB X and Y axes. Can anyone tell me why or how to adjust it to center by using the auto calibrate or is this normal behavior?
Psry does the stick rest forward when the plane is 'cold & dark'
Pbut move to center when you start up & throttle a bit?
ACurrently RGB isn’t supported at the moment, it’s mostly dependent on Walmis reverse engineering an existing Virpil base
WAre you using an asymetrical throw limiter?
3The stick is loose when plan is cold and dark., but when the plane starts it settles forward of center when straight and level flight. After I adjusted the X and Y axes its close to center. Without the game running and the axes adjusted manually and with the stick on it settles just aft of center. It's game related. I only have tried it in IL2, so I don't know if it's the same for other games. I have no idea what a asymetrical throw limiter is so I don't think I'm using one.
3Also when I switch to auto pilot and have auto calibrated the stick moves to the center position and when i take it out of auto pilot it again moves forward and the planes nose drops.
NWhich aircraft in IL-2 and, is this with or without TelemFFB? I noticed, while writing the telemetry module for TelemFFB, that IL-2 tends to do some really weird things with FFB in some of the aircraft
3It's with all the aircraft. Not using TelemFFB