133 Replies
@Dexter
Note for OP
+solved @user1 @user2... to close the thread when your doubt is solved. Mention the users who helped you solve the doubt. This will be added to their stats.in one case you have a strong base and an alcohol (ie making it a very strong base - RO-) and in the other it is just NaOH and water.
What do you think would happen in the two cases?
Do you recall from SN1/SN2 reactions?
@iTeachChem I guess this should work
dont you need heat for elimination?
We don’t need it per say
It’s an accessory that enhances the reaction I’d say that
Mostly depends upon the kind of reagent you have
The yield won’t be great here as we are not forming a particularly stable alkene but the question seems to expect that we know “elimination” vs “substitution”
mujhe laga only bulky bases would make e2 happen
Naah it's not like that
Any base jiske conjugate acid ka pka is significantly high
Alcohols jaise aren't really very acidic
The conjugates of them tend to act as bases because of that pka values they have
That is fine, i was talking about NaOH wala scene :D
Ulti reaction jyada favourable hai
RO- is clear
NaOH vaale case me to SN2 hi hoga 'cause OH- is a strong enough nucleophile
But not as good of a base as RO-
Yeah it can act as a base sometimes
(Maybe minor product elimination bhi milega but it won't be much)
But mostly H20 se Kam acidic species ke conjugates
They tend to perform elimination in water
(solution is ofc aqueous here 'cause you don't find "neat" NaOH at most places lol)
Ahmm I guess I’ve made a mistake
And by looking how confident I was…..
lol
@iTeachChem really sorry 😭
bro i am oc noob, i keep checking sites haha
its all good
James Ashenhurst
Master Organic Chemistry
Deciding SN1/SN2/E1/E2 (2) - The Nucleophile/Base
Deciding SN1/SN2/E1/E2, Part 2: The Nucleophile/Base. Once we've analyzed the substrate, the next step is to analyze the nucleophile base. Let's dig in.
Chemistry LibreTexts
11.12: A Summary of Reactivity - SN1, SN2, E1, E1cB, and E2
these two i checked to be sure
I just checked ethanol and methanol ka pka
I just checked this thing
And remembered Williamson synthesis
😭
Primary carbon pe there is no stabilisation of that alkene
That’s why it forms the SN2 product
Heyy @Prasan sorry for this
Sending you the correct thing wait
Ngl I’m making a lot of mistakes these days @iTeachChem 😭
It’s sleep deprivation fr
Last night @hardcoreisdead was asking me a few questions…..
I missed a carbon while counting in many of them 😭
Organic Chemistry with Victor
YouTube
SN1 SN2 E1 E2 Predictive Model || How to determine the mechanism
In this video I'll show you a quick method how to determine the mechanism when it can be either SN1, SN2, E1, or E2.
00:00 Introduction and Review of the Mechanisms
04:25 Predictive Model Overview
05:25 Reagents' Nature
09:34 Predictive Model Details
📝 Download the Organic Chemistry Study Notes 📝 https://www.organicchemistrytutor.com/sho...
lmfao i made him forget sn1 and sn2 too
To whom lmao?
The guy who asked?
u
Lol I just need sleep at this point
if only i could be fixed ths way
:sweaty:
I guess I can
When I'm not sleepy I don't usually say shit like that 😭
you good bhai?
@Varun_Arora the answer given is according to your rxn that you sent first in which you made ethene.
See if it's given that way....
It's wrong
I've explained you the reasoning above
They just wanted to know ki you know the difference between a base and a nucleophile
But they took a bad example to test that
If this ever shows up on the exam, then follow this
It would not be wrong I can guarantee
alright
If it does to unki side se issue hai
They gotta fix it as you challenge and stuff
bhai bhot problem ha oc mei kya btaun
Ngl these people make questions while they are half asleep
fr tho
Mera first solution was a pure result of me being sleep deprived 💀🙏
jee mains vale aise kaam kar rahe hain
Literally williamson synthesis works like so good in the lab
Vo bhool gaya mai neend me
😭
Mains advance dono bhai
adv mei bhi hua aisa?
Advanced me still it kinda gets a bit more logical
in basic NTA
They do make shitty questions yes
Har saal aata hai wurtz ka ek question jo lab me nahi karwata koi reaction
Multiple products me se choose karwate hain jo bante bhi nahi hain lab me
yar please give some tips on oc. i just finished haloaklanes and haloarenes and the quesns are very tricky for me rn
Just want to you to eliminate the other options and pick out a possibility jo hoti bhi nahi hai favoured actual conditions me
They would be for now
I'll just say hang on
same same qwestion
Aldehydes and Ketones
Vo chapter acche se karna
Don't stress out too much about anything before that
'cause if you study this chapter "logically"
You can basically do almost all of 11th-12th OC
and even beyond tbh
okayy
and i had another quesn
in ngp
Hmm
ill just send the quesn wait
Hmm batayo kya question hai
Sure
Abhi neend me nahi hun utna hopefully sahi ho 😭
isme to cynide additon hoga na
in the halogen replacement
Alcoholic*
Notice
isme ngp hoga
aaa
bas kaise hoga isme dikkat
Are you sure
yes
Let me see for a moment ruko
alkyl cynaide hi to banega
Nahi
Alcoholic hai
Cyanide would form HCN
Which is a weak acid
To deprotonate nahi hoga jyada
After it's protonated by the alcohol
....
Bhai how is this.....
Let me check pka
Wait a sec
i remember this very nicely cuz maine kafi ques kiye hai isme
I don't know this seems weird for some reason
..it does
but mechanism banao
'cause I've always heard of HCN being a weaker acid than alcohols
Doing that wait
yup ill try too
even if it gets protonated where will the proton come from?
sahi baat ha
The alcohol
Acidic enough to protonate a stronger base
Cyanides are weird
I gotta understand them today I guess
Kayi baar base ki tarah behave karte hain
Kayi baar nahi
Ohkay
There's this new thing I got to know
RO- is better solvated in alcohols than cyanides are
'cause oxygen is a better hydrogen bond acceptor
(you might not studied hydrogen bonding with respect to this acceptor-donor definition)
(I can elaborate on this if you guys want)
(maine khud ye pehli baar tab padha tha when I was solving someone's doubt around this only)
(we literally rediscovered hydrogen bonding that day lmao)
yes pwease
See
damn
What's there in a hydrogen bond
One molecule provides a proton
That can be taken up by an electronegative atom
i mean its like a partial bond isnt it?
Yeah it is
thts why we use dotted line
The bond kind of oscillates between the too
Yeah exactly
how so?
It's like dono jagah hai thoda thoda
Like one has an actual bond
But that bond becomes a bit weaker
ahh ok
Some of the electron density "shifts"
And intermolecular attraction improves
hn it will
(of course if the h bonding is intermolecular)
So now
hn
The atom that provides you with a proton
It should be electropositive enough to not cry when another atom takes up the proton
The donor
And the other one should be electronegative enough to take it
The acceptor
so like when a molecule with enough electropositivity and having H bonding during a rxn can give proton easier?
than other parts of the molecule
It will affect the reactivity of the acceptor
Kyunki hydrogen bonding is usually a "solvent effect"
Solvent interact karke makes it difficult for the reacting species
hn
To go and attack the species it intends to
So hamare case me
There is only one donor
Alcohol
But there are two acceptors
Cyanide and Alkoxide
so the h bonding area can either make reaction very east or bhery hard?
YES EXACTLY
ok ok got it now
Now in this case
par ye sab humari ncert mata ke queestion me hoga use?
Isse correct answer aayega actual vala
Ncert mata me kuch chizon ki explanation hai nshi
Vahan use ho sakta hai
okey
This equilibrium will be favoured forward
Bohot saara RO- hoga solution me
but is wale question me yeh nhi use hoga na?
cuz nta
I'm still weirded out ngl
Abhi trying to figure out kya hoga
CN- will substitute
That's sure
Uske aage dekhta hun
hn
On how the "NGP" thing goes on here
kuch? bhai organic ki ncert ke 30% reactions ka mech nhi hai plus kaafi cheezein ye trick i.e. markovnikoff se batate hain
I mean... Yeah
lmfao
I honestly think organic is written in the worst way possible in NCERT
ncert sucks.
They've not done it well at all
I only love how they've written physical chemistry
physical sucks as well
is question me to SN1 hoga kya?
Naah
so much
SN2
Carbon pe hai negative
kyu?
Strong enough nucleophile
Solvent se mechanism decide nahi hoti
"enhance" hoti hai
Agar SN1 ho rahi hai
To polar Protic me better hogi
But agar hoi SN2 rahi hai
i need revision for sure
Dw
I need it too
I'm in a worse condition I guess
chalo phy time i will go
Yeah sure do
fry hoke aungi organic karne
Will ping you
Jab ho gaya
I'll get done with this
hn please
ouh
bhai physics hi to ha jo logical ha, chemistry mei to kbhi kbhi lagta kuch bhi chalraha ha
Kuch bhi nahi chal rha bhai
Ye bhi logical hai bhai
Taught very wrongly tbh
Agreed
haan
yar youtube channel batado koi chem ke liye badhia
oc with victor, yehi dekhlu?
It’s good
Don’t get dependent on it though
And tbh jee neet organic me vaise bhi they don’t expect much logic
Vo expect karte hain ki tum yaad kar lo
Use your logics well yes
But the exam will throw you with weird questions and some weird solution where all of it fails
So yeah try to understand as much as you can
Ask teachers
Ask people here
alright
thanks bro
+solved @Varun_Arora @Sephrina
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