I already have a load cell stick though

scriptedpr•12/16/22, 3:48 AM

So that makes sense why it wouldn’t support ffb in the sim bc the real plane won’t have ffb on the stick. But helos, warbirds and center stick aircraft in dcs all have ffb?

scriptedpr•12/16/22, 3:49 AM

I fly the hornet a lot for instance. I haven’t gotten much into helo or warbirds yet but plan on it

SSwiftVengeance I already have a load cell stick though

scriptedpr•12/16/22, 3:52 AM

Which stick do you have?

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 3:55 AM

x65f

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 3:57 AM

📃general

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 3:57 AM

this is the ffb effects for all modules

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 3:58 AM

real planes have ffb, the question is which ones

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 3:58 AM

and how they do it

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:00 AM

anything ww2 or earlier have ffb because their control surfaces are linked directly to the stick like on a car with no power steering

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:01 AM

so all the effects from the wind would be very strong

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:02 AM

post ww2 you get hydraulic power steering and now fbw

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:03 AM

there is back drivable hydraulic controls which still allow you too feel a bit of the effects and non back drivable which wont transfer any effects

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:05 AM

then there is fly by wire (fbw) which is totally different. its like your telling the car where to go and it does that for you so you never loose control

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:06 AM

well at least its like that for the f16. I dont know how the f18 does it

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:11 AM

in my opinion all planes should have ffb effects available in dcs. because you are flyng in a sim you cant feel the g forces, shaking, vibrations etc of the aircraft which you would be able to in real life through the seat and cockpit.

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:13 AM

feeling what the plane is doing allows you to control it to the limit or just being more immersed in the simulation just like with a car ffb wheel

scriptedpr•12/16/22, 4:14 AM

Yea I agree even if the f16 is force sensing irl and you can’t really feel anything through the stick. In sim you should for that exact reason

scriptedpr•12/16/22, 4:14 AM

That’s how sim racing is. Some things are translated in sim you may not feel irl bc we don’t get seat of our pants feeling

scriptedpr•12/16/22, 4:15 AM

Bc my sim rig is shared with iracing idk if I could even fit a center stick in the first place so I may have to go with a side stick and if I do I’ll get the fssb and just use it for all aircraft. I’m sure it would work fine for helos

scriptedpr•12/16/22, 4:15 AM

And warbirds. Not ideal but still good enough

scriptedpr•12/16/22, 4:16 AM

I’ve read some people use it for every aircraft just fine

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:16 AM

my stick only works well with f16

scriptedpr•12/16/22, 4:16 AM

From msfs to helo to warbirds

scriptedpr•12/16/22, 4:16 AM

I’ve used the real sim fssb lightning and loved it

scriptedpr•12/16/22, 4:16 AM

Which is why I’m considering it

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:17 AM

everything else is very hard to fly with my stick, but it might be different for fssb

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:17 AM

im using a msffb2 at the moment as a side stick

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:18 AM

it has force feedback

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:18 AM

and I switch it out for the load cell stick when im flyng f16

scriptedpr•12/16/22, 4:20 AM

I only flew fbw aircraft with it I think. It’s been a while since I used it but the feeling has stuck with me. I felt like I was flying with my mind. I think I tried the tomcat with it too and did alright. Landed in a carrier with it in the hornet

scriptedpr•12/16/22, 4:21 AM

Took me a few tries lol

scriptedpr•12/16/22, 4:21 AM

A side stick would make more sense for my setup though. I’m using a gt omega prime cockpit

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:22 AM

yeah its amazing with f16, I can pull exactly as hard as I want to and just in general its super intuitive

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:23 AM

but with other modules its way way harder because you hands get tired and you have to constantly correct etc etc

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:24 AM

I dont think you will enjoy flyng other modules with it

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:28 AM

my hand is constantly moving back and forth doing small movements especially in helicopters. I read some people got used to it after a while but I wouldn't get my hopes up, and especially you will loose out on ffb effects too

TTheLurk🌽In the Apache if the stick is outside the sleeve the scas will go to limits and ...

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:29 AM

https://youtu.be/K_yCn5yqHAY

YouTubeMr. Simulator

scas apache

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:30 AM

the white box and green cross are following my input

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:31 AM

I thought scas is supposed to be following trim position?

Sscriptedpr So that makes sense why it wouldn’t support ffb in the sim bc the real plane won...

原

原子力Hoshino•12/16/22, 4:39 AM

helos need ffb for simulating force trim; while since warbirds using cables/rods etc to connect flight controls and control surfaces, FFB is needed.
That said, modern planes, including some of the FBWers, FFB is still valuable for programming a more realistic curve and swapping btwn different type of aircrafts with ease, as well as for simulating the trim actuator that move the stick when trimming, and Autopilot actuator for some.

原

原子力Hoshino•12/16/22, 4:41 AM

Also ppl would like the so called "FFB" effect such as stick shaker for high AoA, taxi around, etc, albeit in real life those effects is actually mostly come from the shake of the entire airframe

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:42 AM

Its the same in racing sims, you can feel the texture of the road and other things through the wheel

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:43 AM

And if the whole airframe is shaking then the stick would be too no?

原

原子力Hoshino•12/16/22, 4:45 AM

I think it's actually a bit different no? the steering wheel actually will receive force feedback from the wheel where as the flight controls of hydraulic/FBW aircraft don't

SSwiftVengeance And if the whole airframe is shaking then the stick would be too no?

原

原子力Hoshino•12/16/22, 4:46 AM

yeah but the sim pilot won't if without a motion rig or jetpad/buttkicker

原

原子力Hoshino•12/16/22, 4:48 AM

so if the only thing shakes is the stick, it's kinda werid..

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:50 AM

Well yes, in a car the forces are transfered through the wheels and then you feel them through the steering wheel but you can still feel vibrations through the seat and floor. In a aircraft you can feel some vibration etc through the frame and they make their way to the stick anyways no?

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:51 AM

If you dont have a motion rig or jet pad then you will feel the vibrations through the stick only but if you have those then you will feel vibrations everywhere

SwiftVengeanceOP•12/16/22, 4:53 AM

In racing sims even though a lot of road cars we race have power steering we just ignore that and use the same ffb effects across all cars

SSwiftVengeance there is back drivable hydraulic controls which still allow you too feel a bit o...

原

原子力Hoshino•12/16/22, 4:53 AM

hmmm just curious can you give an example for the back-drive hydraulic? didn't really read into that doc too much

I've been told 777/787 is but don't know others

I already have a load cell stick though

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