Yep and if you do multiple wraps of the cable around the motor pulley (enough to unwind its travel)

Yep and if you do multiple wraps of the cable around the motor pulley (enough to unwind its travel) and the cable is secured to it, it will be a lot less

Ssmitty Yep and if you do multiple wraps of the cable around the motor pulley (enough to...

ju_caesar•5/5/23, 4:09 PM

You are only referring to the second part about the pre tension, correct?

Jju_caesar You are only referring to the second part about the pre tension, correct?

mechsicko•5/5/23, 4:48 PM

The shaft winding technique req a cross-hole in the drive shaft, and 3-4 full wrapps of cable either side of the hole before going to the final pully. The advantage of this type of system is it allows extremely small drive 'gear', allowing high ratios in compact form factor. Also eliminates the need for matching belts/pulleys. You just need to figure out a way to tension the cable in situ, which there are several ways to accomplish.

Kevlar rope is ideal for this because it has almost zero stretch where steel cable is rellatively springy. Kevlar stretch like 1-2% @ 50% break strength, steel is like 20% iirc.

Here's an example of shaft winding, using steel cable in this case.

smittyOP•5/5/23, 5:05 PM

on my pedals i probably used a thicker steel cable than necessary (1.5mm bike brake cable) but it works well. at rest there is no motor shaft side load, even in a belt replacement setup there is no load at rest. the only tensioning needed would be just enough to keep the wire in the pulley grove, any more is unnecessary. these cables have ~150kg break strength so stretch isnt an issue. even the 1.2mm stuff is good to 110kg

FFinnSwede Not technically related to the RHINO, but I saw you built your own VKB adapter. ...

walmis•5/5/23, 5:50 PM

Yeah, I have those available, DM me

Bomkata•5/5/23, 5:58 PM

hello, wondering how well this will work with a 200mm extension

Bomkata•5/5/23, 5:58 PM

kingjamez•5/5/23, 6:10 PM

Thanks all for the insight into cable driven systems. That’s super helpful! I too don’t quite understand why the side load forces would be greater. With non-stretch cable the load is low at least in perception (when I tension the wires for zero backlash). My stupid order for belts isn’t supposed to arrive until June so I will be able to go through quite a few iterations to see if I can make something work well before then. If this works, I think it’s lack of specific components (belts, gears, pulleys) would make it a flexible option for FFB systems.

Wwalmis You should be able to tune this with the spring curve tool

Will3D•5/5/23, 6:29 PM

It does help, but there is still some movement. Just wondered if there was anything else I should try.

BBomkata Click to see attachment

Stoned Kakapo•5/5/23, 6:53 PM

im using this same extension, works fine for me even with a heavy TM f18 grip

Bomkata•5/5/23, 7:03 PM

im failing to locate how much this cost?

BBomkata im failing to locate how much this cost?

indifferent badger•5/5/23, 7:20 PM

https://discord.com/channels/965234441511383080/986474224241741884/986478661848948756

indifferent badger•5/5/23, 7:21 PM

I’m making an assumption you are asking about the Rhino itself.

Bomkata•5/5/23, 7:24 PM

yes i just need the base as i have a virpil mongoose stick

Bomkata•5/5/23, 7:25 PM

lol thanks i know i was overlooking it

Bomkata•5/5/23, 7:25 PM

just needed to scroll to the top lol

BBomkata im failing to locate how much this cost?

kingjamez•5/5/23, 8:00 PM

about 1/2 what it should... but you pay for the extra by being willing to wait.

BBomkata im failing to locate how much this cost?

peachmonkey•5/5/23, 8:06 PM

check the preorder site: http://order.vpforce.eu/

it's 800 Euro's for the fully built unit (option 9). Otherwise you can build it out of a kit (other options), however the kit is incomplete, it only has motors/electronics/software, the actual enclosure/gimbal/etc you need to design/implement yourself.

Google Docs

VPforce Order Request

Order request for VPforce products.
Please note: to reserve a VPforce RHINO FFB base, please use reservation form here.

Once the order is ready to be fulfilled an invoice will be sent to the provided email address.

kingjamez•5/5/23, 9:56 PM

Being in the middle of building one from the DIY kit. The Rhino is an exceptional deal. If you can wait, and don’t need custom enclosures, it’s just huge value / monetary unit.

BBomkata Click to see attachment

Magpie•5/5/23, 11:29 PM

Works great, I had to raise my Sim pit and put the rhino lower into the floor of it to make it ergonomic though

Magpie•5/5/23, 11:29 PM

But you end up with a bout a foot of extension under the grip

Magpie•5/5/23, 11:29 PM

Spitty is still bloody sensitive even with that much throw

ckmoore•5/5/23, 11:39 PM

I'm pretty new here-- so the complete kit (the rhino) is compatible with thrustmaster sticks out of the box?

Cckmoore I'm pretty new here-- so the complete kit (the rhino) is compatible with thrustm...

Number481•5/6/23, 12:17 AM

Yes. Check #

faq .. probably answers a lot of questions you have.

Cckmoore I'm pretty new here-- so the complete kit (the rhino) is compatible with thrustm...

Polack-1•5/6/23, 12:21 AM

yep, Virpil too, since they use the same connector and software supports it. (tested both)

ckmoore•5/6/23, 12:49 AM

Thanks! Looks like i have to start saving, lol

FlatSpin•5/6/23, 1:03 AM

Order one now, it's a long wait, and you don't pay till it's ready to ship.

FFlatSpin Order one now, it's a long wait, and you don't pay till it's ready to ship.

Diverzant•5/6/23, 7:04 PM

Im also new here, what do you recon would be the waiting period?

amadeus•5/6/23, 7:52 PM

!status

Aamadeus !status

VPforceBot•5/6/23, 7:52 PM

Hey @amadeus,
So the last Shipped RHINO is #0090 on 2023-05-04
Average waiting time from preorder to shipped is 161 days, median is 196 days, max is 219 days
89 Rhinos are shipped in total

Mmechsicko The shaft winding technique req a cross-hole in the drive shaft, and 3-4 full wr...

kingjamez•5/7/23, 4:41 AM

I'm currently trying out a design that is closest to this. It still uses a pulley but the pulley has a cross drilled hole and the cable wraps around both sides of the hole. I could have gone with a much smaller pulley but this design gives me around 13:1 gear ratio which seems overkill as is. Who knows if it will work though

I couldn't model the cable in CAD, but it is anchored and tensioned around the back side of one of the edge pulleys (you cant see it but there is a hole where the tensioning bolt will be right behind the top edge pulley. The other side of the cable is wrapped around another edge pulley and fixed in place. This gives 50 degrees of rotation so I'm still limited by the gimbal arms.

PiNKSH!T•5/7/23, 5:35 AM

https://youtu.be/LkHi6TwoezQ

YouTubeWINWING

Goodbye Super Taurus

Thanks to all of the aviators who have been supporting the Super Taurus.
We bring you the last batch of the Super Taurus Combo.
https://wwsimstore.com/view/goods-details.html?id=315
See you in the future.

PiNKSH!T•5/7/23, 5:35 AM

wow ffb throttle

kingjamez•5/7/23, 5:50 AM

FFB is the future for all serious flight sim setups.

Jon (Bounty_V)•5/7/23, 5:55 AM

FFB and haptics in everything

Jon (Bounty_V)•5/7/23, 5:55 AM

we're technically already there with racing sim for mainstream. Except for FFB handbrake

Jon (Bounty_V)•5/7/23, 5:56 AM

If no one else puts out a good throttle and I ever feel like upgrading from my Virpil CM2, I could see potentially getting WW FFB throttle

PiNKSH!T•5/7/23, 7:09 AM

I've come to realize with the Rhino that yeah FFB effects are cool & great for immersion, but the real strength of FFB (anything) is the ability to customize the feeling of the device, like the Rhino, per config/aircraft we can change the length of throw of the stick, the feel of weight etc. all sorts of nuances of the aircraft stick feel, as with ffb racing sim, pedals & even gear shifters can be ffb, you can have basically whatever type of shifter you like all in one unit. FFB throttle would be awesome for so many reasons, yeah AP, ATC etc. obviously but also things like detents for idle, AB etc. I truly believe all the major simulator peripheral companies out there need to get back to FFB.

Jon (Bounty_V)•5/7/23, 7:13 AM

isnt the mythical TECS supposed to have electronically defined detents? the way it read to my very big lack of understanding it sounded like u set a detent in software, and the physical throttle detents are adjusted to reflect what was set

Jon (Bounty_V)•5/7/23, 7:16 AM

what would be really cool is for a throttle to, because of ffb, be able to emulate being rail as well as the one we primarily see (I forget the technical term)

We don't have too many rail throttles these days, main one that comes to mind is the T.16000m throttle. I know TECS was supposed to come in two variants one rail and one what we're used to seeing.

If the effect of both could be emulated with FFB and you just choose which you want via software + change its feel that would be a very nice feature

PiNKSH!T•5/7/23, 7:56 AM

TECS was a joke from VKB that got out of hand, there is no TECS

Jon (Bounty_V)•5/7/23, 7:58 AM

a joke that got so far out of hand it changed the timeline into one that doesnt have the TECS

Jon (Bounty_V)•5/7/23, 7:59 AM

the sad thing is even if it does ever eventually come out it'll never live up to expectations

Jon (Bounty_V)•5/7/23, 8:01 AM

if after so many years it isnt magically the best throttle ever that is immaculate and with all the features one would ever want people will be upset. vkb cant just show us something, give us bullet points of features, and underdeliver after 7+ years

I'd love to see Virpil put their newer joystick base tech into a new throttle though.

PPiNKSH!T wow ffb throttle

Anthony•5/7/23, 8:39 AM

Are you sure that’s what it meant? They show the Taurus moving by itself, so I kinda took the new one moving under the cover to just be a sort of metaphorical “waking up”

Polack-1•5/7/23, 9:41 AM

So F5 has a displaced neutral point - can we do that for the F18 as well?

Polack-1•5/7/23, 9:42 AM

what's the way here, I get that I can set custom stops, but what about moving the neutral point (not quite the same as trimming)

AAnthony Are you sure that’s what it meant? They show the Taurus moving by itself, so I k...

PiNKSH!T•5/7/23, 11:32 AM

If that is the case that's lame af. ppl need to get back to ffb, it's so much better, watching those ffb sim racing pedals too just sorta confirms it, also ffb gar shifters too.

Jon (Bounty_V)•5/7/23, 11:41 AM

https://youtu.be/lDGeQ_eyqEw
Here's one of the FFB shifters. Similar story to the Rhino in terms of how it is made and the scale of production and pricing

And here's a diy project: https://lebois-racing.com/new-srt-gearbox-v9/
https://lebois-racing.com/documentation-srt-v9-1-gearbox/
There's a basic kit you can get off of aliexpress for it (the important bits like the PCB)

YouTubeRace Beyond Matter

First drive in the future of Sim Shifters

This is the first active shifter with actual servo motor to unlock the gears slots only with the clutch and can be the perfect tool for polishing real driving skills! It can be used as Dog Box and SQ shifter as well and can be train for each individual car and open the gear slots in specific RPM window!
You can find more here from- https://mvhst...

Lebois RacingLebois

New SRT gearbox V9 ! - Lebois Racing

The new SRT Gearbox V9 is out now ! It is a new milestone in terms of reliability, features and experience. Find out what is new. If you follow me on Facebook, you probably already know that for personnal reasons, I won’t have so much time in the coming months. That’s why there isn’t a […]

Lebois RacingLebois

Documentation of the SRT V9.1 gearbox - Lebois Racing

The new best gearbox in the world for Sim Racing !

Polack-1•5/7/23, 11:42 AM

Another question: I don't know if I broke anything when installing Virpil stuff, but I think TelemFFB gave me FFB effects in Bf109 but I don't get any at the moment? Fw190 for example works without a hitch, but 109 has a limp stick throughout. I really need to try getting TelemFFB working with just the python version - for the moment I'm not sure how to install whatever dependencies it needs

Jon (Bounty_V)•5/7/23, 11:44 AM

my take on the WW throttle video is, it isn't hard to hope winwing does something more than basically just the same thing with slightly updated internals or just a F15E version.

Looking at the impressive and unique things they have done lately it has almost become commonplace to expect something amazing.

Yep and if you do multiple wraps of the cable around the motor pulley (enough to unwind its travel)

Similar Threads