Noob question here... Is the Rhino or any software the Rhino uses capable of reading out LVars from MSFS? The reason i am asking is the following. The current H145 (and the soon to be released H160) use LVars to define the control positions. Now when you are flying with the autopilot, it will move the stick around depending on the regime (move the stick to the left for a left bank for example). Is there any possible solution to achieve this with the Rhino? Any help is appreciated!
unfortunately it's nowhere near as simple as all that. TelemFFB, the software that drives FFB for the Rhino with MSFS uses a library called pysimconnect. Pysimconnect, as the name implies, is a python library for subscribing to simconnect data. This is how we retrieve all the telemetry needed to generate the FFB stick forces as well as the other effects. AFAIK it does not support LVARs, and one would need to develop or make use of another interface library to do so.
All of that said, even if one did get a stream of the LVAR data working, there are further challenges that make something like this exceedingly difficult (or very messy) to pull off. This is the same challenge with implementing any sort of trim following movement to the stick in MSFS.
The fundamental problem is that when you move the stick (either with your hand, or by using the motors), that "moves the axis" since it is bound in MSFS. So if you try to purposefully move the centerpoint of the stick in response to trim telemetry data, not only is the sim adjusting the trim, but the stick is moving the elevator (or aileron, or rudder) axis at the same time so you end up with very coarse trim adjustments.
The Brunner software "solves" this by advising you to edit the aircraft config files in the MSFS file structure to render the trim inactive in the aircraft. By doing this, they remove the double-input problem but that is horribly messy.
They also advise that you do not bind the axis' in MSFS. They send the axis position via simconnect. This is what you would need to do in your example of "follow the autopilot". You would need to do that so that you can stop sending the stick position when the autopilot is engaged (so MSFS doesn't know the stick is moving), otherwise the AP will disengage because MSFS thinks the stick is moving.
That is also messy since simconnect data is sent/received at an interval equal to your framerate. That's fine if you are running 100+fps in pancake mode, but becomes a problem of poor control input resolution if you are in VR running at 30FPS and have a drop down to 20.
Sorry for the novel length response.. I've put a lot of thought into how to add trim following and/or autopilot following capabilities into TelemFFB in a clean way and have come up empty.
Hey, thank you so much for the very detailed and valueable answer!
While i won't say that it still should be possible there might be some ways to still do it i think. A nice guy over at the HPG discord build his own FFB stick using stepper motors and hall sensors amd using FSUIPC and a own lua script to get it done.
The LVars are in fact retrievable using another python based library.
Maybe i misunderstand you here, but the trims in helicopters work different than in airliners for example. In helicopters the AP actually drives the stick to the physical position needed to attain a specific attitude. This is the exact same position you need to move the stick to when handflying to achieve the same attitude. So i don't see the double input problem here or am i missing something?
Thanks again for taking your time and the detailed explanation!
I fully understand trim in helicopters vs fixed wing aircraft. My comment about trim was more generic in nature as an example of the fundamental issue. Helicopter force trim has further issues in MSFS as it barely even implements the concept (why would it since it doesn't support FFB).
There is a force-trim implementation in TelemFFB for MSFS but it does not interact with the simulator in any way. It is a hardware only implementation and is identical to the hardware trim you can set up in VPforce Configurator (except that it doesnt implement hat trim adjustments, only 'force trim button').
Regarding the autopilot following.. it would entirely depend on how the sim, or the aircraft, handles the joystick inputs while the autopilot is active. My guess is that since it expects a joystick to always be at 0/0 when it is idle (remember, it has no concept of FFB or axis offsets), any deviation from 0/0 would cause an AP disconnect. Perhaps not, but the only way to really know would be to implement the feature and that wold be an awful lot of work just to find out it doesn't work.
I didn't want to sound like i doubt that you know how helicopters work. Just wanted to make sure we are talking about the same thing.
The helicopter i am talking about has a 'no springs' option which let you deflect your stick while using (internal) trim release and creates a new center where you release trim release. So that should be helpful.
But i have no doubts that it will still be very complicated to implement the autopilot logic.
I will play around a bit and have a chat with the coder of the helo. Until then i will enjoy the Rhino in it's current state.
So thanks again for your effort and the very helpful information.
While waiting for my Rhino to be built and arrive I am thinking of going into VR…. I am undecided between the Varjo Aero and the Bigscreen Beyond. Which one would you recommend?
Depends on if you value comfort or clarity. I am biased as I have the aero (since day 1) and have zero complaints about the comfort. Performance in "my sim" (DCS) is second to none with dynamic foveated rendering support. Its an absolute steal at the new price in my opinion.
BSB uses a 3d scan of your face to make the pad.. might make sharing to show a buddy or selling it in the future difficult. also it is stemvr only, there is no native openxr (unless mbucchia makes one like he did for pimax!)
So I recalibrated my rhino to work better for the stick throw limiter I made, then the forces were off, so I clicked the reset button, but it factory reset it. I can’t figure it out now. Does anyone have a way to upload the settings just like it came out of the box? Thanks
Look for vr flight sim guy on yt, he has a few breakdowns on those 2 plus the pimax. Keep in mind the price decrease was recent so older vids will be taking the old price into account.
Another thing to consider is the software powering the device. Varjo software is, simply put, incredible. Top of the line high end software that would be far superior to anything BSB offers.
There's also a ton of pre-established tweaks and fixes and setting adjustment by the community to get as much performance as possible out of the Aero for flight sim
Another thing to consider is PC hardware. Are you on at least a 3080 with a decent CPU? Also you need to be using Nvidia GPU for the Aero, not sure about BSB.