well the thing is I mostly fly modern jets & helicopters with the mcgu & have the stick feeling ligh

well the thing is I mostly fly modern jets & helicopters with the mcgu & have the stick feeling lighter anyway, (at least for the FBW eg. FC3 F-15c). I'm pretty sure ppl here are using the TM F-18 grip with extensions on the Rhino & that grip is even heavier. The mcgu is a really good stick for heli's & modern aircraft, I mean really it's still good for warbirds (the brake lever eg.) or GA too & it has so many buttons, hats etc. & options to swap hats for axis & in the software you can still have the axis mini sticks act both ways. Also being able to still use the vkb software is a bonus. If you fly modern incl. FBW & warbirds/GA too, then maybe consider getting a second grip like the kg12.

PiNKSH!TOP•5/2/23, 5:22 AM

I have thought about getting the mcgu grip shell 3d printed or resign, something strong & lightweight. I'm not sure about the weight difference but check out the virpil's CM2 it's a modern Russian style grip.

PPiNKSH!T well the thing is I mostly fly modern jets & helicopters with the mcgu & have th...

TonyM•5/2/23, 5:41 AM

Thanks for the feedback! I fly mostly helis and Warbids. I use for heli a Virpil Alpha-R as cycliq and for fixed wings/ warbirds a MCGU (that replaced a VKG SCG Space Combat). For me the MCGU is by far the best stick I had so far in terms of feel (a little bit to large however for my smaller hands). Unfortunately it is already too heavy with a 200mm extension to be used as a cyliq with the GF MK.III. The Virpil Alpha-R is also made of metal but it really doesn‘t feel as nice as the MCGU. At least to me.
I am waiting for my Rhino and I hope that I will be able to use my MCGU. Worst case I will use my Virpil Alpha-R.

TTonyM Thanks for the feedback! I fly mostly helis and Warbids. I use for heli a Virpil...

PiNKSH!TOP•5/2/23, 5:51 AM

Oh you'll deff be able to use your mcgu, I do & it's fine, 9Nm is still a decent amount of torque, one of the Logitech steering wheels can have as little as 3Nm of peak torque, even the Fanatec CLS with the boost kit only has 8Nm. Just get the kg12 for warbirds m8, it's got all the buttons you need for a warbird really. Also I've considered adding a left SCG (from the EVO I'm using atm for collective) to the GF III base & add a small dampener to it & mount it to be used as a collective, until I get a proper one.

PPiNKSH!T Oh you'll deff be able to use your mcgu, I do & it's fine, 9Nm is still a decent...

TonyM•5/2/23, 5:55 AM

I use the Virpil collective, it is good but honestly it could be better as like many other people I did the Nyogel mod and I added a dampener. I am sure the V2 will be better.

Dddrake1984 Haven’t heard from him since

aniron•5/2/23, 7:26 AM

Not his first rodeo. He did basically the same thing on the ED forums a couple years before the Discord. A shame that he couldn't get his products to market, but trying to do everything all at once is not easy.

NNumber481 Has anyone successfully mounted their Rhino to a Virpil desk mount? I've come u...

Number481•5/2/23, 11:46 PM

Updated my design to make building it a bit more achievable.. will use a on online laser cutting and bending service to have the pieces made. Will be using some adjustable furniture legs I found as the feet for the mounting plate.. Probably won't have it made with the logo cutout, but it looks cool in the rendering

PPiNKSH!T yeah right, I have the Rhino & a 200mm vkb extension & use the mcgu which I can ...

Will3D•5/3/23, 1:18 AM

Yup, would love to see an X8 pro motor option!

VPforceBot•5/3/23, 8:14 AM

:package:

RHINO #0086 Has Shipped!

Number481•5/3/23, 3:11 PM

Temporary redneck mount… works pretty well so far.

kingjamez•5/3/23, 4:09 PM

I don't know man, that looks pretty solid to me. I'd have a hard time paying a bunch of money to make that only slightly better.

Kkingjamez I don't know man, that looks pretty solid to me. I'd have a hard time paying a b...

Number481•5/3/23, 4:16 PM

Haha. Yeah, it is pretty solid. Some black spray paint would go a long way in making it look less red-neck-ish.

At least it gives me some time to decide if I want to spend the $120 to have pieces made (plus an extra $60-80 if I want them powder coated or anodized).

LeLv30_Superbus•5/3/23, 8:36 PM

Stowing it might get a bit annoying because when unpowered, the stick will fall.

LeLv30_Superbus•5/3/23, 8:58 PM

Nothing redneck about the looks, just give it a lick of paint.

LeLv30_Superbus•5/3/23, 9:02 PM

Test with max torque

ofc

Magpie•5/4/23, 2:41 AM

Mate just get a whole plywood board and bolt that to the pedals and bolt the stick to that. Then use the weight of your chair to keep it stable

Magpie•5/4/23, 2:42 AM

You can thank me later, you'll get far more use out of your rudder when you know you can kick it without it skidding

Magpie•5/4/23, 2:42 AM

Or just use it for little 5mm movements

MMagpie Mate just get a whole plywood board and bolt that to the pedals and bolt the sti...

Number481•5/4/23, 3:32 AM

Was that for me? I can kick my pedals all day long. Micro suction “tape” on each of the 4 feet keep it extremely secure, yet I can peel it up and move it if needed. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00M7FC1K8. Also locking roller blade style wheels on my chair.

Number481•5/4/23, 3:33 AM

I work and play from the same desk so it all needs to be movable.

VPforceBot•5/4/23, 9:44 AM

:package:

RHINO #0087 Has Shipped!

VPforceBot•5/4/23, 10:28 AM

:package:

RHINO #0089 Has Shipped!

VPforceBot•5/4/23, 11:19 AM

:package:

RHINO #0090 Has Shipped!

DeltaVJ•5/4/23, 12:55 PM

https://tenor.com/view/charlie-chaplin-modern-times-production-gif-7401366

Tenor

WWilliam Oakes Yep, I'm somewhat along that path. I'll post some details when I get a chance.

William Oakes•5/4/23, 1:56 PM

Posted some details in showcase channel https://discord.com/channels/965234441511383080/972180323787997255/1103681326546161724

Jon (Bounty_V)•5/4/23, 2:41 PM

I'm very excited for the potential that has. Especially looking forward to when Walmis is able to snag a set himself.

kingjamez•5/5/23, 3:13 AM

Does anyone know of another name for a "cable drive"? I'm doing a knockoff of the Rhino and have been modeling up a drive using steel wire or kevlar thread. It's a technique I learned from an old 3d printer I used to own: http://bootsindustries.com/cable-drive-system-rostock-3d-printer-bi/

Boots IndustriesJean Le Bouthillier

Cable Drive System - Rostock 3D Printer BI

kingjamez•5/5/23, 3:14 AM

However, searching online I see very little talk about cable drives... I'm thinking there must be another name for it that I'm missing. ~to me~ it seems very well suited to a FFB stick and I don't have to wait for shipping from China for a belt.

kingjamez•5/5/23, 3:14 AM

i think I can get fairly high gear ratios because the motor end pulley can be very close to the shaft size.

kingjamez•5/5/23, 3:24 AM

I'm building two cable drive gear sets right now. One with steel wire one with kevlar wire, and already have the HTD gears done.... just waiting on the belts to arrive. I plan to test them all, but am just looking for any advice from others who have used this method.

Will3D•5/5/23, 7:10 AM

Using the large 86blf04 motors I find they don’t have much torque around centre. I don’t have play in my system as the smallest movement registers in the VPForce software. I’ve tried increasing the spring curve around centre and it helps a little. Is there any way to improve this further? Or is it inherent in these motors ?

walmis•5/5/23, 8:07 AM

You should be able to tune this with the spring curve tool

Kkingjamez I'm building two cable drive gear sets right now. One with steel wire one with k...

ju_caesar•5/5/23, 9:48 AM

The reason why you might not find much information on that is that the smaller the radius, the higher the force in the cable, which is theoretically good, as you would need only a relatively small pulley on the gimbal for the same final torque.
...but also, the higher the force in the cable, the higher the force the bearings need to hold. If you increase this force too high, the bearings might fail fairly quickly.
And I am not too keen on how easy it is to replace the bearings inside the motor.
The pre-tension you need in a cable drive is also higher than in a toothed pulley drive.

SskyPickle https://www.fsmissioneditor.com/

MattGoodman•5/5/23, 12:07 PM

I just found that issue too with XpForce. Where the hell do we get it from?

(whilst we wait for the better solution from Walmis for MSFS that is)

I see on another forum that the author says it's a false positive. Did you find it was ok?

Jju_caesar The reason why you might not find much information on that is that the smaller t...

smitty•5/5/23, 12:51 PM

Tension on the cable is much less than what a belt would need. it's just enough to keep it in the rollers. Also, the side loading on the motor shaft is almost nothing- since the cable pulls are 180 degrees apart. A belt has to be pulled tight in one direction to keep the teeth from skipping. Also if you're looking for a better name than 'cable drives', look for 'flight control cables'

FinnSwede•5/5/23, 1:00 PM

Not technically related to the RHINO, but I saw you built your own VKB adapter. Does anyone know if the plastic piece with the contact pads for the stick had to be custom built or is it an off the shelf component from somewhere?

FinnSwede•5/5/23, 1:01 PM

For illustration, and you can probably see why I'm looking for leads on a new one.

Troll 🇸🇪 🇳🇴•5/5/23, 2:48 PM

Does anybody know of a shop that sell HTD5 pulleys and ships with DHL?
I got my pulleys today, but the chinese Ebay store managed to send one wrong pulley and one was missing. The two motor pulleys and the belt was correct though…

Ssmitty Tension on the cable is much less than what a belt would need. it's just enough...

ju_caesar•5/5/23, 2:52 PM

The problem of the motor bearing load does however exist when one is trying to use a cable instead of a pulley in a normal pulley drive configuration like we see on the Rhino, which is what the OP described as far as I can tell.
I admit that indeed the pretension might be a non-issue. And as long as you just want to use the cable as a belt replacement and not to make the drive put out 3 times the torque, you should probably be good regardless.

TTroll 🇸🇪 🇳🇴Does anybody know of a shop that sell HTD5 pulleys and ships with DHL? I got my ...

TheAmazinGreat•5/5/23, 2:52 PM

I’m 3D printing pulleys for mine. You could look at that route.

TTheAmazinGreat I’m 3D printing pulleys for mine. You could look at that route.

Troll 🇸🇪 🇳🇴•5/5/23, 2:54 PM

Yes, I may. But I just wanted to see if anyone knew of a good online shop.

TTroll 🇸🇪 🇳🇴Yes, I may. But I just wanted to see if anyone knew of a good online shop.

TheAmazinGreat•5/5/23, 2:54 PM

I’ll be in the same need when it comes time for belts, can’t 3D print those.

Troll 🇸🇪 🇳🇴•5/5/23, 3:08 PM

What software do you use to design your pulleys with? @theamazingreat

TTroll 🇸🇪 🇳🇴What software do you use to design your pulleys with? @theamazingreat

TheAmazinGreat•5/5/23, 3:18 PM

I haven’t designed any yet, just starting with the existing 70t in the FFB base files floating around here/discord. I did make some changes in fusion 360 to the hub to fit my use but still leaving it at 70t diameter.

TheAmazinGreat•5/5/23, 3:19 PM

I also modified the hub of the 14t to press fit onto the profile of the 86 series motor shaft to avoid using grub screws.

Kkingjamez Does anyone know of another name for a "cable drive"? I'm doing a knockoff of th...

mechsicko•5/5/23, 3:20 PM

I always called it 'shaft winding' but that's probably not the real term either

TheAmazinGreat•5/5/23, 3:20 PM

Next step is working out belts and tensioning methods. Will either be a idler pulley or possibly a clamping system built into the 70t pulley.

Jju_caesar The problem of the motor bearing load does however exist when one is trying to u...

smitty•5/5/23, 3:33 PM

Yep and if you do multiple wraps of the cable around the motor pulley (enough to unwind its travel) and the cable is secured to it, it will be a lot less

Ssmitty Yep and if you do multiple wraps of the cable around the motor pulley (enough to...

ju_caesar•5/5/23, 4:09 PM

You are only referring to the second part about the pre tension, correct?

Jju_caesar You are only referring to the second part about the pre tension, correct?

mechsicko•5/5/23, 4:48 PM

The shaft winding technique req a cross-hole in the drive shaft, and 3-4 full wrapps of cable either side of the hole before going to the final pully. The advantage of this type of system is it allows extremely small drive 'gear', allowing high ratios in compact form factor. Also eliminates the need for matching belts/pulleys. You just need to figure out a way to tension the cable in situ, which there are several ways to accomplish.

Kevlar rope is ideal for this because it has almost zero stretch where steel cable is rellatively springy. Kevlar stretch like 1-2% @ 50% break strength, steel is like 20% iirc.

Here's an example of shaft winding, using steel cable in this case.

smitty•5/5/23, 5:05 PM

on my pedals i probably used a thicker steel cable than necessary (1.5mm bike brake cable) but it works well. at rest there is no motor shaft side load, even in a belt replacement setup there is no load at rest. the only tensioning needed would be just enough to keep the wire in the pulley grove, any more is unnecessary. these cables have ~150kg break strength so stretch isnt an issue. even the 1.2mm stuff is good to 110kg

well the thing is I mostly fly modern jets & helicopters with the mcgu & have the stick feeling ligh

Similar Threads